Converter, RGB or Composite video to VGA?

[Nick Kennedy]

I'm thinking of firing up one of my old Atari computers but don't have an old monitor or TV. Are there converters out there that will convert the Atari video output to VGA?  HDMI would be OK I guess, but VGA suits what I have better right now.

 

As I recall, the Atari 800 had both composite video and RGB available.  Plus a modulator to convert the composite video to TV channel 2.

 

BTW, I have seen some boards on eBay and AliExpress that look promising, but the product descriptions are hard to follow. I'd like to be reasonably sure the gadget has a chance of working before I buy it.

 

Regards,

 

Nick

"the SIO2PC guy"

 

[NorbertP]

Amazon sell countless variations of this sort of thing - I have an HDMI version and while it's not as good as a Retrotink or similar it's also a fraction of the price. The 800 also has separate chroma and luma outputs so you'll get slightly better quality with an S-video version. (No RGB - the A8 is essentially "native S-video".)

Edited November 14, 2022 by NorbertP

[TGB1718]

I have a convertor that does S-Video and Composite video to VGA, my only issue is the

size of the VGA display, mine is a square box that probably only uses 1/2 to 2/3 of the screen

so make sure whatever you get is suitable.

 

The picture itself is fine though.

 

Also make sure you have a way to get sound to the monitor, if using an S-Video lead then

you probably have separate audio leads, but the composite  lead has the Audio included, so the

convertor need to have an audio jack to split the sound off.

[Ppyo]

I got one of those S-video to VGA, they work well. Agreed totally on the fact that you need to make sure your svideo cable addresses the audio output separately for external speakers.

That said, you may also need to upgrade the video chip, as the original one does not do good with current LCD displays: color bleeding, slightly skewed.

UAV or VBXL/VBXE do the trick. I got UAV, but still need to install it (my soldering skills are null). 

[oky2000]

You get what you pay for with converters so be careful. The item details are meaningless, you need to get an opinion from somebody who owns one already or see one on youtube.

 

There is also the issue of making sure the gamma and chroma output are spot on technically, i.e. the same as when it left the factory, on your Atari 800 to get the best possible conversion. Garbage in/garbage out as usual for computers

 

 

[Nick Kennedy]

Thanks all for the good and informative responses. Yes, I was wrong about RGB, I see in the hardware manual it's Luma and Chroma or Composite. I haven't known much about video standards in the past so now I'm learning that the Luma and Chroma outputs constitute an S-Video signal.  (Right?)  And that could give me a better display than composite, which makes sense. I expect to pipe the audio signal out separately.

 

I'm dipping my toe into trying one of my old Atari computers which have been boxed up for 25 years or so. I did a tremendous amount of programming on those things. The opening question is: Will one still power up and play?

 

OK, I've verified that I have at least one that works. Thanks to an old Casio "pocket TV" with a 2" screen - I was able to connect the RF cable to it and get the blue screen and barely legible "ATAIR COMPUTER    MEMO PAD".  Hurrah!

 

Not sure if I have the ability to load a program. I have an old 1050 disk drive which may or may not work. I don't think my old SIO2PC system is going to work on a modern PC. What are people using these days?  I'm sure there's something with a USB drive and maybe an Arduino to do an interface similar to the old SIO2PC.  Yes?

 

Thanks,

 

Nick

[+CharlieChaplin]

6 hours ago, Nick Kennedy said:

Not sure if I have the ability to load a program. I have an old 1050 disk drive which may or may not work. I don't think my old SIO2PC system is going to work on a modern PC. What are people using these days?  I'm sure there's something with a USB drive and maybe an Arduino to do an interface similar to the old SIO2PC.  Yes?

 

Thanks,

 

Nick

 

Define modern PC. My older dual core PC with 2x 3Ghz still runs MS-DOS and SIO2PC.exe V4.21 from one of two harddisks (the other hdd runs Win XP). With this PC and SIO2PC I am creating all my ATR images, e.g. the Abbuc magazine disks.

 

[+Stephen]

21 minutes ago, CharlieChaplin said:

 

Define modern PC. My older dual core PC with 2x 3Ghz still runs MS-DOS and SIO2PC.exe V4.21 from one of two harddisks (the other hdd runs Win XP). With this PC and SIO2PC I am creating all my ATR images, e.g. the Abbuc magazine disks.

 

I'm guessing he just needs a machine old enough to have a serial port.

 

BTW - welcome @Nick Kennedy, one of the originals here!

[Beeblebrox]

I'd personally probably start out with either an Sdrive max SIO device or a modern SIO2PC SIO to load all that XEX and ATR goodness - since the latter are all cheaper options. Ultimately though for me either a SIDE3 or AVG cart or perhaps a Fujinet sio wireless device would be the ultimate device to have. Sdrive max is the Arduino based device I think you are alluding to.

 

Sdrive max: https://atari8bit.net/tutorials/de-re-sdrive-max/

 

Modern SIO2PC (where I believe you created the original BITD if I am not mistaken 😞https://retrolemon.co.uk/atari-8bit-storage-devices/38-sio2pc-usb.html

Use the above with RespeQt software with your modern PC:https://forums.atariage.com/forum/184-respeqt-sio2pc-software/

 

There is also Atarimax SIO2PC: https://atarimax.com/sio2pc/documentation/

 

Sio2sd units also:https://retrolemon.co.uk/atari-8bit-storage-devices/47-sio2sd-set-device-cable-soft.html

 

Also check out the amazing emulator Altirra - which can emulate the A8 and also modern A8 upgrades and peripherals amazingly well: https://www.virtualdub.org/altirra.html

When I am not running my real A8 hardware I use Altirra.

 

Fujinet:  https://fujinet.online/

 

AVG: https://retrolemon.co.uk/atari-8bit-storage-devices/125-avgcart.html

 

SIDE3.1: https://retrolemon.co.uk/atari-8bit-storage-devices/53-side3-cartridge.html

 

Other hardware upgrades: 

 

Incognito for Atari 800's: https://retrolemon.co.uk/atari-8bit-upgrades/104-incognito-atari-800-fjc-firmware.html

 

Ultimate1MB: https://retrolemon.co.uk/atari-8bit-upgrades/88-ultimate-1mb-fjc-firmware.html

 

RAM upgrades from AA fourm member reifsnyderb include 1008k Axlon board: https://forums.atariage.com/topic/334549-1008-k-axlon-compatible-board-wbase-ram-and-no-soldering/#comment-5044773 

and an external plugin 320k Parallel Port RAM Upgrade for 600XL & 800XL: https://forums.atariage.com/topic/336161-320k-parallel-port-ram-upgrade-for-600xl-800xl/

 

Many more of course which I've not listed. 

 

Check this out too btw for a comparrison of modern multicart mediums: 

 

source

 

If you have been away from the A8 scene that long there are tones of hardware upgrades and storage devices now. And coding wise we've had some amazing games, and continue to do so. (Prince of persia, Final Assault, Flob, Albert, The last Squadron, Bunny Hop, Arcadia, Bubbleshooter,to name but a few........and a Doom engine is in the pipeline - where the video linked to is the actual real time engine running off an a8).

 

Check this out too btw - new hardwre from Candle (guy behind the SIDE3, U1MB, Incognito and many others):

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by Beeblebrox

[Nick Kennedy]

Again, thanks.  So much good info and so many resources in both hardware and software available.  Long live the Atari!

 

I ordered a S-video/composite converter so we'll see how it does.

 

The SDrive Max looks pretty amazing and I may be giving it a shot.

 

I plan to try that Altirra emulator.  Back in the 90s, I was using something called XF3 Xformer by Darek Mihocka that was very faithful.  I was actually writing and assembling my Atari code on it.

 

Yes, I should have kept an old DOS compatible 286 or 386.  And maybe a monitor too. I'm pleased that someone can still run SIO2PC 4.21.  Hard to believe, but until recently, my main PC did have a real serial port on its MB and I wired it out. I doubt if SIO2PC would function under the Console/Terminal screen that executes DOS-like commands under Windows 11. As I recall, SIO2PC made a lot of direct writes to the UART rather than use OS calls. That would likely mean no FTDI either.

 

I'll try to report after I try the video converter, the original basis for this thread.

 

Regards,

 

Nick

[+Larry]

As the originator of SIO2PC, you might want to try APE for Windows. Runs on Win95 up through Win10. There is also a Dos version that is more like the original SIO2PC.  I think you would be pleasantly surprised to see where Steve Tucker (Atarimax) took the concept.  Free Windows software trial version that should run with your original interface.  Runs nicely with USB, but can be somewhat troublesome to run with a generic USB interface.  Lots of added features!  There is also RespeQt which runs nicely with a generic USB adapter.  A little different than APE.  It is a creation of several folks that started with software called "Atari810" by Dan Vernon.

 

You got me started with SIO2PC by building me an interface, probably in the late 80's.  I still use APE to this day.  I've tried the SDrive, etc, but I never leave APE.  Perhaps the best replacement that I've found is the AVGCART with an SIO attachment.  But it still lacks the power and ease of use with ATRs of the Windows system.  IMO, of course.

[Nick Kennedy]

OK, time to report on the video converter. It's kind of a mixed bag. It was $16.99 from Amazon. First I hooked up the composite video and I was able to see the blue screen with text. A little smudgy with some pink mixed in, but a good start.

Next I cut the S-video cable that came with the gadget and connected one end to a DIN plug to go to the Atari, bringing out the chrominance and luminance signals.  I also hooked the audio pin to a 3.5 mm jack so I could plug it into a sound system.

The S-video hook-up produced a reasonable text screen, but when I plugged in an Asteroids cartridge, it wasn't pretty. Smudgy images and wrong colors. I fooled with buttons on the converter but that didn't seem to have much effect.

OKY2000 suggested that the gamma and chroma signals might need to be adjusted. Are there internal adjustments for that?  And would I just tweak until I like what I see? I do have several Ataris I could try, so that might be an interesting experiment.

 

Oh, here's the video gizmo I bought:

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08HH3DPKX?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

 

Thanks all,

 

Nick

 

 

 

[theoakwoody]

I play console games on an old ibm vga monitor and it’s fantastic.  It’s not cheap but if you pick up a retrotink you can go rgb or svideo to hdmi and then vga convertors are very cheap but reliable.  Everything looks great with minimal lag.  It’s as close to a PVM setup as I’ll ever have.

Edited November 19, 2022 by theoakwoody