No Accounting for Taste - Your Guilty Pleasures and Unpopular Favourites

[zylon]

1 minute ago, Tanooki said:

Well Zelda does that, just not so transparently with patently obvious XP numbers and Lv listings.  Within 5min you can easily walk places on the map (if using a guide, fair, given Nintendo handed them out in the day free or for a few bucks.) to get you +2 heart containers.  I do admit I don't blame you with the cart only and play to fun/to completion without online videos and typed up junk I get that.  I don't remember whatever screen you'd jump into from the next where you are surrounded and can't strike unless you move.

 

Maybe you'd like the Japanese FC versions of those NES games as I can think of 2 Sega games that got the shaft stateside, Afterburner and Fantasy Zone are both quite poorer here than there.

While I turbo buttoned my way through Crystalis, that's probably the extent of my ARPG game skill. I can do Chronicle of Radia War as well. SMS, Lord of the Sword and Golden Axe Warrior, an that's about it. Dragon Warrior, Phantasy Star, Shining force, FF 1 &3, BOF, Lufia, FF Legends 1/2/3, STED, etc. However, it's not as if I dn't try other things, which is how I found Soul Blazer and Dragon View. I'll likely not beat them, but they are fun enough, and don't quash hope completely. I've got an original Lagoon which flat out sucks, but I actually get somewhere. None of my employees, who were willing to try, got any further than I do, unless they just ran through screens, going for distance, lol.  I pay a minimum of $18 per hr to my weaving staff, and even paid to play, none could do much with LOZ, despite having played newer ones. I have one of those "looks like a gameboy" NES handhelds, and we put it on the big security monitor, if quotas are hit, and time left to kill.

[Tanooki]

Well Crystalis, if you can do basically the video game version of the blind taste test goes, stacked up against the original Legend of Zelda, Zelda loses.  Crystalis is just so well done, learned its lessons from what Nintendo did and made an all around dramatically better game, more closer to Link to the Past in general qualities than the old title.  If you can handle Crystalis and not Zelda it's largely because Zelda drops you into a hole and says DIG...no direction, just go for it, which is largely why I think they gave away partial maps and cheaply sold full ones between early hand outs, packed in mini bits, and then later in the players guide and NP in an early issue.  Strangely you can do Golden Axe Warrior which is a pure Zelda 1 clone right down tot he confusion elements so that's strange.  I can't speak to Dragon View really, ignored it, but Soul Blazer that's a gem, more on the level of Crystalis really in that it has a nice story and just well done.

 

As I said Zelda leaves you hung out to dry.  I've always had Nintendo Fun Club, then Nintendo Power Magazines and from that entire run there was so many classified information hint section tips and tricks, then eventually some partial and full spreads, the mini fold out the NES game had in the box, and the early guide (NES Altas and the first I never then had the original players guide) laid the entire game out.  They knew it was early and confusing, even in those years it was confusing so they spread the info, and if you really were hard up they sold the Zelda Tips&Tricks gold colored paperback to baby you through the full game (they had a SMB1 too as a companion.)  I'm not surprised you, others younger, or even older who may have forgotten it or never played it would be totally lost.  Wasting so much time on that game I just remember like 70% of the places still on it, it's the random bombable and burnable crap to get you added money, gambling, etc I can't remember anymore.

 

Seriously I'd just get a map, not a cheat sheet, just a map of the games overworld with icons on it of whats hidden on whatever screen and your life would be far happier.  It's the same damn short sighted failing of the old Metroid 8bit games too, confusing samey layout, shit lack of directions, and you just go in circles until you're fed up or making progress and may not even realize it.  All those games would have been lightyears better with just a map that opened up as you opened it up.

[zylon]

44 minutes ago, Tanooki said:

Well Crystalis, if you can do basically the video game version of the blind taste test goes, stacked up against the original Legend of Zelda, Zelda loses.  Crystalis is just so well done, learned its lessons from what Nintendo did and made an all around dramatically better game, more closer to Link to the Past in general qualities than the old title.  If you can handle Crystalis and not Zelda it's largely because Zelda drops you into a hole and says DIG...no direction, just go for it, which is largely why I think they gave away partial maps and cheaply sold full ones between early hand outs, packed in mini bits, and then later in the players guide and NP in an early issue.  Strangely you can do Golden Axe Warrior which is a pure Zelda 1 clone right down tot he confusion elements so that's strange.  I can't speak to Dragon View really, ignored it, but Soul Blazer that's a gem, more on the level of Crystalis really in that it has a nice story and just well done.

 

As I said Zelda leaves you hung out to dry.  I've always had Nintendo Fun Club, then Nintendo Power Magazines and from that entire run there was so many classified information hint section tips and tricks, then eventually some partial and full spreads, the mini fold out the NES game had in the box, and the early guide (NES Altas and the first I never then had the original players guide) laid the entire game out.  They knew it was early and confusing, even in those years it was confusing so they spread the info, and if you really were hard up they sold the Zelda Tips&Tricks gold colored paperback to baby you through the full game (they had a SMB1 too as a companion.)  I'm not surprised you, others younger, or even older who may have forgotten it or never played it would be totally lost.  Wasting so much time on that game I just remember like 70% of the places still on it, it's the random bombable and burnable crap to get you added money, gambling, etc I can't remember anymore.

 

Seriously I'd just get a map, not a cheat sheet, just a map of the games overworld with icons on it of whats hidden on whatever screen and your life would be far happier.  It's the same damn short sighted failing of the old Metroid 8bit games too, confusing samey layout, shit lack of directions, and you just go in circles until you're fed up or making progress and may not even realize it.  All those games would have been lightyears better with just a map that opened up as you opened it up.

For the record, never finished Golden Axe Warrior, but made if fairly far. I had it on Gamegear, which died and I never replaced it. Then again, I had whatever came with it. That was in the 90's, so I may also have been bit lucky, and found enough to get by. Otherwise, that one was more direct in what you had to do and where. Just about every screen had something hidden somewhere. Kill the enemies, and if you have the Ax, just lay waste to everything possible, and pump your guy up. No need to leave and reenter screen for each try either. None of the dungeons were completely hidden either. While Sega played Monday morning QB on it, they did give enough to keep me hacking at it. I'd place it closer to Link to Past, minus the dimension hopping crap. I mentioned before kinda liking how that one playes, but stopped in first temple thing, where I was sent for a pendant?, because I kept falling off stuff, and ended up dodging these rolling cannonballs forever. I watched a how-to video on it, and my impression was NFW! My nephews might want grandma's games someday, so I hang onto them, try occasionally. She didn't beat them either. 

Dragon View is the only other side scroller ARPG I've had success with, to this point. Only a half hour test play though, so add salt where needed.

I did complete Sword of Vermillion, maybe 10yrs ago, but did much from reading walkthrough pages, etc, so I don't list that among my accomplishments. That's a triple train wreck, lol

Instead of Lord of the Sword, I actually got that confused with Golvelius.

Edited July 21, 2023 by zylon

[zylon]

Since we've mentioned it, and few probably play it- 

 

[CaptainBreakout]

I'm pretty tempted here to spring on the SNES multicart with all the hacks and translations, including BS Zelda.

 

I paid for a custom SNES cart of Zelda: Ancient Stone Tablets a few years ago.  The game is split into four parts, which each are treated as separate ROMS.   The game can reference the saved memory from each other part, however. They simulate the four times the game was originally allowed to be played in Japan, and each segment is a sequential build-up.

 

The whole thing is very weird and unfortunately missing the videos from the original event in Japan where this game came from... But it's intact enough on the SNES so that I felt it was worth getting a cart made of it... even if it cost a premium. My Ancient Stone Tables Zelda cart did not come from AliExpress.

 

Still, these ROMS were what the BS Zelda game was made from. On the BS Zelda game, a team combined them, hacked back in the Link sprite, and basically remade the original NES game for the SNES from the Ancient Stone Tablets ROMs.

 

I think I got that right... Anyway, what a weird way to go.  I think it would be fun to play/own just for the strangeness of the story... Plus I guess it's a 16-bit OG Legend of Zelda. 😁

[Tanooki]

9 hours ago, zylon said:

For the record, never finished Golden Axe Warrior, but made if fairly far. I had it on Gamegear, which died and I never replaced it. Then again, I had whatever came with it. That was in the 90's, so I may also have been bit lucky, and found enough to get by. Otherwise, that one was more direct in what you had to do and where. Just about every screen had something hidden somewhere. Kill the enemies, and if you have the Ax, just lay waste to everything possible, and pump your guy up. No need to leave and reenter screen for each try either. None of the dungeons were completely hidden either. While Sega played Monday morning QB on it, they did give enough to keep me hacking at it. I'd place it closer to Link to Past, minus the dimension hopping crap. I mentioned before kinda liking how that one playes, but stopped in first temple thing, where I was sent for a pendant?, because I kept falling off stuff, and ended up dodging these rolling cannonballs forever. I watched a how-to video on it, and my impression was NFW! My nephews might want grandma's games someday, so I hang onto them, try occasionally. She didn't beat them either. 

Dragon View is the only other side scroller ARPG I've had success with, to this point. Only a half hour test play though, so add salt where needed.

I did complete Sword of Vermillion, maybe 10yrs ago, but did much from reading walkthrough pages, etc, so I don't list that among my accomplishments. That's a triple train wreck, lol

Instead of Lord of the Sword, I actually got that confused with Golvelius.

GameGear?  Hmmm I only ever had the SMS version, fantastic little game, shameful it barely got a US release as it's such a Zelda1 try hard, but has these minor improvements on it since it came just a little bit later.  Having only owned this one in the 00's era I didn't have all that kid time to be lost and not care and just keep going, so it was quite confusing like old Zelda because the generalized concepts of the world are the same as Sega really lifted it.  Like you said, no hidden dungeons, more stuff was a bit more apparent, that's the big difference with the small matured changes.  I guess if we stuck to Zelda I'd put it closer to LTTP, but maybe more like Link's Awakening which due to the 8bit limitation was a bit more reserved in some ways so maybe that.

 

I could NOT get into Vermillion, bought a copy off someone here a year or two ago and tried it and it just fell flat, swapped it out for something else I did care for more at the time with someone I knew.  Golvellius I liked on SMS, never got anywhere near the end it was one of those cheap games thrown in with others so I'd just pick at it.  Crazy (and sucks now) it was on iOS for years from dotemu, then they I guess lost the license as it was pulled fast and ghosted but I did enjoy poking away at it on mobile which was weird.

 

** I looked up GAW it was never legitimately on game gear, master system/mark iii only.  You either forgot, used a SMS convertor, or got some weird cart with the roms hacked onto it.  They do exist, I have some GG multcarts which have hacked SMS games to work on GG.

[zylon]

3 hours ago, Tanooki said:

GameGear?  Hmmm I only ever had the SMS version, fantastic little game, shameful it barely got a US release as it's such a Zelda1 try hard, but has these minor improvements on it since it came just a little bit later.  Having only owned this one in the 00's era I didn't have all that kid time to be lost and not care and just keep going, so it was quite confusing like old Zelda because the generalized concepts of the world are the same as Sega really lifted it.  Like you said, no hidden dungeons, more stuff was a bit more apparent, that's the big difference with the small matured changes.  I guess if we stuck to Zelda I'd put it closer to LTTP, but maybe more like Link's Awakening which due to the 8bit limitation was a bit more reserved in some ways so maybe that.

 

I could NOT get into Vermillion, bought a copy off someone here a year or two ago and tried it and it just fell flat, swapped it out for something else I did care for more at the time with someone I knew.  Golvellius I liked on SMS, never got anywhere near the end it was one of those cheap games thrown in with others so I'd just pick at it.  Crazy (and sucks now) it was on iOS for years from dotemu, then they I guess lost the license as it was pulled fast and ghosted but I did enjoy poking away at it on mobile which was weird.

 

** I looked up GAW it was never legitimately on game gear, master system/mark iii only.  You either forgot, used a SMS convertor, or got some weird cart with the roms hacked onto it.  They do exist, I have some GG multcarts which have hacked SMS games to work on GG.

It was renamed Ax Battler, for gamegear. Exactly the same game, or at least I think it was, with just a name swap. Golvelius was a present one year, in a time when it might have been the only game I got that year. I played what I had. Later on the 90s, we bought a crap load of stuff from SCI, who was selling Sega's leftover inventory for most systems. Vast majority of my GG games, were bought that way. I'd bought a system around my final HS years, 93-94. I believe I finally sold the last of the NOS stuff in 2021. I remember taking it to work, and just clearing screens to find stuff to load up with.

Edited July 21, 2023 by zylon

[Tanooki]

Different game.  Ax Battler was more of a Zelda II ripoff, it's mostly compared to it.  Golden Axe Warrior was the next game in the franchise, and they went backwards and copied original Zelda.  So you're kind of right, right track at least, just wrong zelda.

 

There are a number of overlap titles for the GG though and SMS, depending on region.  Usually it was a GG game that got back ported to the SMS either in Brazil+PAL markets or just Brazil.  Some of them are just astoundingly good quality as well.  The two GG Sonic and Streets of Rage games made it SMS in those spaces, as did Dynamite Headdy, Vampire(Master of Darkness), Battletoads, and more.

[SlidellMan]

I might as well show gameplay footage of Addams Family Values:

 

[CaptainBreakout]

Ladybug!!! 

 

Although this is known as an excellent homebrew here.

 

I got the really big cartridge version today.

 

 

 

[WavyGravy]

On 7/20/2023 at 11:43 PM, zylon said:

Since we've mentioned it, and few probably play it- 

 

Dragon View is actually incredible! One of my most pleasant surprises back in the day just going through random ROMs. It's kind of a beat-em-up RPG if I had to pin it down to something, and a damn good one at that. Reminds me of a sort of proto-Muramasa: The Demon Blade, if anyone played that one.

Another one that I think could use a little love is Brain Lord by Enix. Awkwardly named, awkwardly translated, and visually unimpressive, to say the least. It didn't seem to make much of a splash when it came out for those reasons, but if you dig into it, it's a really solid action RPG with some great puzzles and a soundtrack by the composer of Cybernator/Assault Suits Valken, Masanao Akahori.

I'm also going to throw HyperZone by HAL into the mix. I think HyperZone doesn't do a great job of explaining itself, and I feel like people write it off as being a dull tech demo/Space harrier clone. It's actually a really fun score attack game that rewards you for clean runs and high-scoring plays. You upgrade your spaceship by reaching certain score thresholds in between stages. If you're finding that the game becomes really difficult once you hit a certain point, you probably didn't score high enough to get a ship that's appropriate for that level, so you need a cleaner, higher scoring run next time, and you'll get further. That loop in and of itself probably turns people off, but I found it to be a lot of fun. A fantastic soundtrack, too, by Jun Ishikawa, as is tradition in HAL games.

[SlidellMan]

Well, Wavy, I happen to also like Hyper Zone and Brain Lord. The latter was basically the closest thing to a third StarTropics game.

[WavyGravy]

I've actually never put that together with Brain Lord and StarTropics, but you're right! This is going to be one of those things like the FedEx arrow where I'll never be able to unsee it, isn't it?

I do wish Nintendo would do something with StarTropics, it might be a good time now with 80s/90s retro being so huge.

[Biff Burgertime]

I wish I knew about StarTropics back in my Funcoland days of "walk in with $10, walk out with 20 NES games." Not necessarily because they all had to be cheap, but because most games were affordable enough to take a chance on despite limited/zero information. Plus between that and NESticle, I woke up every day with the primary goal of playing as many NES games as possible. Up until that point in my life, game options were so limited... it was incredible.

 

Of course I still play NES games now, I pretty much exclusively play stuff from the 8-bit to "128-bit" eras. But eh. By the time I finally got around to trying StarTropics, I put a few hours in and just felt like I'd done all that stuff before. But no doubt there was a time in my life gone by where I would've loved it.

[Tanooki]

Hyperzone is an understated and under appreciated gem, a nice mix of like sega super scaler shooters and f-zero in style which just works.  I don't have it currently but have had it in the past more than once.  Yet, Dragon View I've never touched it, being told it was a sequel in spirit or whatever to Drakkhen I passed on that so fast, but it does look more interesting.

 

I feel much like @Biff Burgertime does about Startropics, I mean it's nice, but it's like this weird Zelda/Goonies(yoyo etc I guess) style thing and it never really grabbed me.  I don't hate or even dislike it, but I can't get into it.  I couldn't in the mid/later 90s, still can't 30 years later.  I think if I hadn't been on the SNES day one, was stuck as a kid on a budget with some fool parent doing the lame protest against upgrades with my NES even longer I probably would have adored it (other than that obnoxious water based insert letter frequency shtick, that sucks.)

 

Back on track with SNES you know I have a hell of a guilty pleasure sticking a bit with the Japanese theme I started back on page 1 with Ultraman, but why not go with Ranma 1/2 Hard Battle.  The company that popped that out wasn't know for good stuff DTMC, and the box art on it is god awful ruining the entire anime aesthetic of the title, but if you knew the title, you know what was coming it's Ranma of course.  The graphics are colorful, the audio is quite good including some nice and clear spoken audio samples.  It is as complex and chaining as a SF2 release, no, but is it bad?  Nope, just different.  And if you approach it like SF2 you'll probably even hate it too since it's not your usual quarter circle stuff, but the moves do make sense, they do work, and the game has a decent challenge as well.  Each character has good motion, double jumps possible, chains possible, it just flows smooth between the moves which are plentiful from standard attacks to special stuff as well.

 

The plot is hardcore goofy Ranma nonsense, want good grades?  Beat the shit out of one class mate after another to pass the class!  Pounding on not just students but this deck of cards looking tool called King who looks like the traditional King art.  It's totally worth a try, though when the sequel arrived no one picked it up so it stayed in Japan, but that one does have SF2 style controls and flows so well people tend to prefer it.

 

I found a long play where someone didn't power through the comedic script to lead off the game and the in between either so enjoy.

 

Funny how this topic keeps going for all the right reasons, and said reason also had a quality post 8 months ago, how times have changed.

Edited October 11, 2023 by Tanooki

[SlidellMan]

Fun fact about That Ranma 1/2 fighting game: It is the only one that has an English dub with the Viz Media cast.

[+Black_Tiger]

On 3/3/2023 at 12:09 AM, Bloodreign said:

Super Valis 4, a game most people don't seem to like, and one I beat my first try when I rented it all those many years ago. Personally, despite that, I like the game, the music is great, the colors pop nicely, even if the other 2 playable characters from the PC Engine CD version are absent, as well as any story narrative the CD version had (not even any text between levels driving the story forward), but damn it, I can't help but to like it still.

Games like this are fun to play when you aren't a child/teen who doesn't have to choose only one or two games a year to own or spend your limited money on a rental.

 

Even with the entire library of every classic console at your finger tips, it's easier now to just appreciate games just for what they are.

 

It feels more like arcade games bitd. Because you weren't required to invest a lot of time and money you'd just try anything and enjoy the good parts.

[Tanooki]

I'd agree with that not only on Valis 4 SFC/SNES but just Valis in general.

 

I have that SNES game now, got it back a year ago locally by a both dumb luck find, and one a reseller lowballed themselves on at an indoor peddler shop.  It's like Valis games all a just slight bit off, stiff maybe, but it controls tight enough and the challenge is on the harder side of the spectrum for sure.  If this was as said above one of your few games a year you'll finish it, a lot, but get salty over how it could have been more.  The Genesis Valis 1+3 and the wonk SD(it's really not good) SD anime #2 they did have equally similar issues, same with the PCE stuff on Card or CD.  I've dabbled with most, even tolerated those clowns at LRG to get the 2 Volumes for Switch as the dumb (and I mean dumb as literally stupid) developer only put it on Nintendo and not PC too, to get the entire setup back in my hands.  They're solid games, I'd say an A- quality anime canned story and visuals, but a true B tier title (some C like Syd of Valis if that) series in general.  Just take them for what they are, kind of a mindless hack n slash you'd maybe see in an arcade situation but in this case it's not.  They're fun, but you can even do better.

 

I'd roll up Kendo Rage into that comment too which I also own as it has some similar mechanics as well.