romeoteknik Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) Since Atari is working with some of the homebrew devs with some amazing official releases, is it possible at all for an official Rikki & Vikki cart release? Would this solve the issue with sound emulation if the cart had the required chip? If there ever was a powerhouse of a game to show off the 7800+, it’s this. Atari should do what it can to make it possible. Edited August 23 by romeoteknik 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H.Fraenkel Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 8 hours ago, DEANJIMMY said: Hi, I am not Al but might have some answers, too 😉 The 7800+ is based on the 2600+ but will have a better cartridge socket (like the 2600+,Rev2 will have) and new chips for dumper and controller inputs. On 2600+ with latest SW 1.1x-r6 and dumper x03 from this forum the games you mentioned should run (I have Dungeon Stalker and Al confirmed ARTI and EXO, so I ordered them). All my carts except some Champ games with ARM support run. Centipede TB (7800 or 2600) will start but the Trakball is not supported yet. Hopes are high it will be supported on the 7800+, not sure about the 2600+ yet (related to the new chips?). The 2600+ can play PAL and NTSC, that will be the same for the 7800+. In Germany you still can sometimes get NTSC carts as they gave wrong colors on a PAL machine for a good price, so I got e.g. Pitfall! NTSC and like the higher game speed🤗 Colors are always correct! For PAL60 games colors were often wrong in the past but once it got reported here, they fixed it in next release. The sw update support you get on this forum is great! If you report something, they often can fix it🤙 First of all: thank you very much! I have the 2600+ in the first edition, but only installed the first beta update thing at some point and haven't followed it much since then. So I'll probably look into it first to see if I need a 7800+ at all. Will the 7800+ also work with the Game Drive Cart? I assume that the 2600+ still doesn't work with the Harmony Cart, even with the latest firmware, right? But if you say that most of your games work with the exception of the Champ Games stuff ... what about Lode Runner or Penult, for example? I still have them here too ... and after the beta update they didn't work. I'll probably have to try it out again myself with SW 1.1x-r6 and the Dumper x03, if I can find instructions on how to install it. I just don't have much hope ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEANJIMMY Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 7 minutes ago, H.Fraenkel said: First of all: thank you very much! I have the 2600+ in the first edition, but only installed the first beta update thing at some point and haven't followed it much since then. So I'll probably look into it first to see if I need a 7800+ at all. Will the 7800+ also work with the Game Drive Cart? I assume that the 2600+ still doesn't work with the Harmony Cart, even with the latest firmware, right? But if you say that most of your games work with the exception of the Champ Games stuff ... what about Lode Runner or Penult, for example? I still have them here too ... and after the beta update they didn't work. I'll probably have to try it out again myself with SW 1.1x-r6 and the Dumper x03, if I can find instructions on how to install it. I just don't have much hope ... Well, with harmony and stuff it should be the same as described in the forum at other places. You might load one game in dev mode with a harmony cart. I don't have these carts and can't tell much about them but don't expect the game drive will start to work. The console is for cartridges. Lode Runner and Boulderdash do not work on the highest experimental release (1.6) as champ games like Draconian fail to dump. They are activly working on it but there is no info yet, if they can fix the dumper on the 2600+. I will order the 7800+ once available on Amazon for some reasons: The cartrIdge slot is much better, I use a prototype in my 2600+ and it has got the same quality as the original socket of my 7800. The new dumper MCU might make it possible to dump the few outstanding carts? The new controller MCU might support Trakballs and other fancy controllers? As I put questionmarks behind the last two, I am not a developer and can't say if that will be also possible on the current 2600+ as well but I guess some limitations led to the decission to use other chips but it also could be supply and price. We need to wait for something official from @Ben from Plaion as these are all just my assumptions and could be of course wrong. I am very happy with my 2600+ on latest release, only very few games do do not dump but like to get a 7800+ anyway as I want another plus console🤙 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H.Fraenkel Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 25 minutes ago, DEANJIMMY said: Well, with harmony and stuff it should be the same as described in the forum at other places. You might load one game in dev mode with a harmony cart. I don't have these carts and can't tell much about them but don't expect the game drive will start to work. The console is for cartridges. Lode Runner and Boulderdash do not work on the highest experimental release (1.6) as champ games like Draconian fail to dump. They are activly working on it but there is no info yet, if they can fix the dumper on the 2600+. I will order the 7800+ once available on Amazon for some reasons: The cartrIdge slot is much better, I use a prototype in my 2600+ and it has got the same quality as the original socket of my 7800. The new dumper MCU might make it possible to dump the few outstanding carts? The new controller MCU might support Trakballs and other fancy controllers? As I put questionmarks behind the last two, I am not a developer and can't say if that will be also possible on the current 2600+ as well but I guess some limitations led to the decission to use other chips but it also could be supply and price. We need to wait for something official from @Ben from Plaion as these are all just my assumptions and could be of course wrong. I am very happy with my 2600+ on latest release, only very few games do do not dump but like to get a 7800+ anyway as I want another plus console🤙 Ok, now I know a bit more, thanks again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 Okay, just sprung onto this news which is really quite exciting even though I've massively slimmed my 7800 collection down. I'm sure some parts of these questions have already been answered in the previous 11 pages but trying to find answers is always hard with 200+ posts to go through! 1) So this will play existing 7800 games (bar the two I saw Albert noted) and the new 7800+ carts will play on existing 7800s? 2) Will the new console support both PAL and NTSC, and likewise will the new 7800+ carts support play on existing PAL and NTSC 7800s too? 3) Will any of the new games also be available through AtariAge Store given Atari now owns AA, maybe in legacy 7800 style packaging? 4) Where is the sound coming from, it's HOKEY right, but is it in the console or on each cart? 5) If the answer to 1 is yes and 4 is inside the console, what happens if you try to plug a 7800 cart with a POKEY already on it into the 7800+? Does the POKEY take priority? 6) Is there the potential for any currently sold out homebrews (eg Ricki and Vicki) to be re-issued under the 7800+ banner? Anyhow, excited to see BBSB get ported finally and anything else on the horizon. If it's fully PAL and NTSC capable, might even be the easiest solution to play the 7800 titles I kept. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Fred_M Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) 2 hours ago, Mayhem said: Okay, just sprung onto this news which is really quite exciting even though I've massively slimmed my 7800 collection down. I'm sure some parts of these questions have already been answered in the previous 11 pages but trying to find answers is always hard with 200+ posts to go through! 1) So this will play existing 7800 games (bar the two I saw Albert noted) and the new 7800+ carts will play on existing 7800s? 2) Will the new console support both PAL and NTSC, and likewise will the new 7800+ carts support play on existing PAL and NTSC 7800s too? 3) Will any of the new games also be available through AtariAge Store given Atari now owns AA, maybe in legacy 7800 style packaging? 4) Where is the sound coming from, it's HOKEY right, but is it in the console or on each cart? 5) If the answer to 1 is yes and 4 is inside the console, what happens if you try to plug a 7800 cart with a POKEY already on it into the 7800+? Does the POKEY take priority? 6) Is there the potential for any currently sold out homebrews (eg Ricki and Vicki) to be re-issued under the 7800+ banner? Anyhow, excited to see BBSB get ported finally and anything else on the horizon. If it's fully PAL and NTSC capable, might even be the easiest solution to play the 7800 titles I kept. What I have read in the 2 topics about the 7800+ 1) Yes 2) Don't know yet, but the 2600+ supports PAL and NTSC for 2600 and 7800 games. So the 7800+ will probably support PAL and NTSC too. The new 7800 cartridges will be NTSC only and can be played in original hardware. 3) Don't know yet. 4) It was confirmed that a Pokey or a Hokey will be in the cartridge. Al/Ben did not specify which one of the 2 will be in the cartridge. 5) The 7800+ is like the 2600+ an emulation machine, so the Pokey in the cartridge will not be used when plugged into the 7800+. The emulator will emulate the Pokey sound. Original hardware will use the Pokey/Hokey in the cartridge. 6) Don't know yet. BBSB will be NTSC only. If I got something wrong I am sure others will correct me 😁 Edited August 23 by Fred_M 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) Cheers! So the presence of the POKEY/HOKEY is merely for buyers who intend to use the 7800+ cartridges on real 7800s? Edited August 23 by Mayhem 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Fred_M Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Mayhem said: Cheers! So the presence of the POKEY/HOKEY is merely for buyers who intend to use the 7800+ cartridges on real 7800s? Yes it looks like that is the case. The 2600+/7800+ are running emulators and is not communicating with the cartridge while playing the game. The 2600+/7800+ dumps the data stored in the cartridge and runs it. It can not address the sound chip in the cartridge, it just detects that Pokey emulation is needed while running the game. Edited August 23 by Fred_M 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 23 Author Share Posted August 23 20 minutes ago, Fred_M said: Yes it looks like that is the case. The 2600+/7800+ are running emulators and is not communicating with the cartridge while playing the game. The 2600+/7800+ dumps the data stored in the cartridge and runs it. It can not address the sound chip in the cartridge, it just detects that Pokey emulation is needed while running the game. That's correct, the cartridges will have POKEY-compatible hardware inside them so they run as expected on 2600/7800 consoles. But the 2600+/7800+ do not need a POKEY chip, since the 7800 games are run through emulation. ..Al 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Fred_M Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Albert said: the cartridges will have POKEY-compatible hardware Good to hear! So it is not a "real" Pokey. That is too bad, real Pokeys would be fantastic for Atari 8-bit computer users (and would destroy the high prices people ask these days for Pokeys) 😂 But anyway, kudos for including a Pokey compatible chip. Atari/Plaion is not forgetting the existing users of old systems 👍 Edited August 23 by Fred_M 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEANJIMMY Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) 2 hours ago, Fred_M said: BBSB will be NTSC only. @Albert @Ben from Plaion Is that correct? In the past seperate sold new carts were PAL in Europe. I could imagine that BBSB is an NTSC cart which runs on a PAL machine and colors do not matter (same with Space Duel, which I have already). I became a big fan of NTSC carts, so I wouldn't care to buy BBSB NTSC. I got Bentley Bear NTSC from AA and play it on my 2600+ but it won't run on a PAL 7800. Will the cart in the 7800+ box be NTSC and the one which gets sold seperately is actually PAL in Europe? Thanks four your answer in advance🤙 Edited August 23 by DEANJIMMY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben from Plaion Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 1 minute ago, DEANJIMMY said: @Albert @Ben from Plaion Is that correct? In the past seperate sold new carts were PAL in Europe. I could imagine that BBSB is an NTSC cart which runs on a PAL machine and colors do not matter (same with Space Duel, which I have already). I became a big fan of NTSC carts, so I wouldn't care to buy BBSB NTSC. I got Bentley Bear NTSC from AA and play it on my 2600+ but it won't run on a PAL 7800. Will the cart in the 7800+ box be NTSC and the one which gets seperate sold PAL in Europe? Thanks four your answer in advance🤙 No, as previous releases, 2600 releases will be NTSC and 7800 will have NTSC and PAL versions. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Fred_M Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 28 minutes ago, Ben from Plaion said: No, as previous releases, 2600 releases will be NTSC and 7800 will have NTSC and PAL versions. Thanks for the clarification! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommodoreCEO Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 (edited) Nevermind... Answered above. Edited August 23 by CommodoreCEO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 Excellent there will be PAL and NTSC 7800+ carts, annoying the carts can’t self detect and you only need to manufacture one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wongojack Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 On 8/20/2024 at 4:33 PM, joshua said: there may be such threads but they would be the minority, some people put giant racing fins and stripes on japanese cars and have forums dedicated to it but majority of people still find it aesthetically unpleasing. both the logo & rainbow look out of place on the euro version because it wasn't originally designed with those oversized dimensions in mind thus it looks like a cheaply/poorly implemented afterthought rather than a balanced redesign, i would be willing to bet if there were a poll started that the majority and maybe even around 70% or higher would prefer the original The more I look at it, the more I think I am with you on this. I especially don't like the "7800+." It looks oversized or somehow out of place. I wish there could be a choice. Surely the case is still in a phase where a color stripe could be updated to be with or without. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 23 Author Share Posted August 23 16 minutes ago, wongojack said: The more I look at it, the more I think I am with you on this. I especially don't like the "7800+." It looks oversized or somehow out of place. I wish there could be a choice. Surely the case is still in a phase where a color stripe could be updated to be with or without. This is exactly how the European 7800 looks, just without the "+". ..Al 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 23 Author Share Posted August 23 18 minutes ago, wongojack said: Surely the case is still in a phase where a color stripe could be updated to be with or without. No, it's well beyond that phase. ..Al 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 29 minutes ago, wongojack said: Surely the case is still in a phase where a color stripe could be updated to be with or without. I am actually really curious, what makes you say "SURELY", if the product is practically shipping? 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giles N Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 (edited) Exclusive extras: American 7800+ Sticker-label? What about $14.99? Edited August 24 by Giles N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7800Knight Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 I just ordered Fatal Run and pre-ordered Bentley Bear's Crystal Quest. Can't wait to get them both! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Neon Wraith Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 All this talk about Pokey/Hokey has go me all turned around. It seems that everyone here is missing the inherent joke in the phrasing and typing it backwards. It should be Hokey/Pokey and you'll turn yourself around. That's what it's all about, isn't it? 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+wongojack Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 5 hours ago, Albert said: This is exactly how the European 7800 looks, just without the "+". ..Al 5 hours ago, Albert said: No, it's well beyond that phase. ..Al 4 hours ago, CPUWIZ said: I am actually really curious, what makes you say "SURELY", if the product is practically shipping? Wow, 3 replies. Yeah, I don't really like it. Oh well some people like things and some don't. I, of course, have absolutely no idea if it is "practically shipping." How would I? Read every post in this thread? The website says pre-order. In our world of classic gaming, things like a collector's edition of a new game sometimes take more than a year to ship after they are sold. Some previous 7800 products were sold and never shipped at all. Who am I to guess when the 7800+ will ship? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nopaybob Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 Amazon shows preorders delivery by Dec 3rd so delivery for us who ordered from atari direct should be end of January to mid February 🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPUWIZ Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 19 minutes ago, nopaybob said: Amazon shows preorders delivery by Dec 3rd so delivery for us who ordered from atari direct should be end of January to mid February 🙄 Amazon pre-order dates are completely random, unless it is a AAA modern game title or something, even then it is always optimistic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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