SIDE next HDD for Atari 8 bit preorder

[Faicuai]

"(...) I would like to sell all my atari goods, its over 400lbs of boards and cases from 8 to 32bits machines"

 

but... why do i find this hillarious?

 

...Weird...

 

...Wait a minute (!?) Could it be another (and renewed) round of "send-your-money-never-see-it-again" ?

 

...400 lbs of "stuff" sounds like good AA-shark-bait, though... ...

[atari8warez]

My suggestion is rather than taking my comment seriously, take his lack of response and holding on to other's money as a serious offense and do something about it.

Such as?

 

You are the moderator and I am not here to tell you what measures you should be taking, but if i was to moderate this board, I would certainly ban him from selling anything here from now on at least until he clears his name and makes this right. I do however have a strong feeling that he's just going to let it go, as evidenced from his last message and if I am right, nobody's going to get their money back or their SIDE, and if that happened I would have certainly banned him from the board forever....

 

I hope I am terribly wrong reading in between his lines and that he would clear his name.

Edited May 29, 2012 by atari8warez

[simonl]

I do however have a strong feeling that he's just going to let it go, as evidenced from his last message and if I am right, nobody's going to get their money back or their SIDE, and if that happened I would have certainly banned him from the board forever....

 

Hmmm... there seem to be a few people doing a lot of flaming on this thread who didn't order anything from Zaxon - the people who did are all competent adults and probably don't need anyone stirring the pot on their behalf who doesn't have a stake in the outcome. Sorry if this sounds unduly critical, but passers-by piling on with the accusations (and occasional insults, slurs etc.) toward someone who is clearly in over their head on something is not likely to help this sorry affair to a satisfactory conclusion for anyone.

 

 

I hope I am terribly wrong reading in between his lines and that he would clear his name.

 

Likewise. I've bought plenty of stuff from Zaxon in the past without any problem, and I would hope to again in future if he can resolve this particular disaster.

 

...Wait a minute (!?) Could it be another (and renewed) round of "send-your-money-never-see-it-again" ?

 

I thought you got a refund for your SIDE order, or am I confusing you with someone else and you're still waiting?

 

Regards,

 

Simon

[Tempest]

My suggestion is rather than taking my comment seriously, take his lack of response and holding on to other's money as a serious offense and do something about it.

Such as?

 

You are the moderator and I am not here to tell you what measures you should be taking, but if i was to moderate this board, I would certainly ban him from selling anything here from now on at least until he clears his name and makes this right.

That's not something I can do. Al can ban him if he wants, but that's his decision to make. The rest of us simply 'keep the peace' so to speak.

[Faicuai]

(...)

 

I thought you got a refund for your SIDE order, or am I confusing you with someone else and you're still waiting?

 

(...)

 

 

...Yes, It looks to me that you may be very "confuzed"...

[Fres]

I hope I am terribly wrong reading in between his lines and that he would clear his name.

 

I think he meant that after he completes these orders there will be no more (no future) ... let someone else do it.

[JamesD]

(...)

 

I thought you got a refund for your SIDE order, or am I confusing you with someone else and you're still waiting?

 

(...)

 

 

...Yes, It looks to me that you may be very "confuzed"...

I'm the only person that I recall getting a refund and that was because I requested it through google wallet before their time limit expired.

[+wood_jl]

zaxon, why talk about stopping making Atari things?      Just finish the SIDE and people will finally be happy.  There are not many people making Atari stuff.  Make this right, and this will pass.

 

People are upset because they did not receive their order.   This would make ANYBODY upset, so it is understandable.    Only a few people attack you personally, most just want the SIDE.  When you make things right with SIDE, why quit making Atari things?

 

I want my SIDE too, but I am glad you post in this thread and give it attention.  Fix this, and then move to next project and hopefully no more difficulty.

[simonl]

(...)

 

I thought you got a refund for your SIDE order, or am I confusing you with someone else and you're still waiting?

 

(...)

 

 

...Yes, It looks to me that you may be very "confuzed"...

 

I'm sure you wouldn't be the first person to surmise that! Yes, I think I had you confused with JamesD as he pointed out. Hope you get one or the other soon anyway,

 

Cheers,

 

Simon

[zaxon]

zaxon, why talk about stopping making Atari things? Just finish the SIDE and people will finally be happy. There are not many people making Atari stuff. Make this right, and this will pass.

 

People are upset because they did not receive their order. This would make ANYBODY upset, so it is understandable. Only a few people attack you personally, most just want the SIDE. When you make things right with SIDE, why quit making Atari things?

 

I want my SIDE too, but I am glad you post in this thread and give it attention. Fix this, and then move to next project and hopefully no more difficulty.

 

I try stopping, becouse i don't see a reason to do any more.

 

There is no fame, no money, a lot of nerve. Anyway, the PCB are in Paris, I do not know if tomorrow they provide, if so then I begin assembly. If not then I start on Monday, photoblog will be the first to know.

[+Firedawg]

I try stopping, becouse i don't see a reason to do any more.

 

There is no fame, no money, a lot of nerve....

 

Those remarks above make are absolutely nonsense. By accepting peoples money you basically made agreement to provide a product at a predetermined price and deliver said product within a reasonable time frame (1 year is not reasonable). Everybody wishes to be appreciated for what they do and if that is what you are implying by using the word "fame", then my suggestion would be to complete this SIDE pre-order and get people what they paid for. Not sure if you will have the "fame" you want afterwards but people will certainly stop talking about you.

 

As for "no money", surely you are joking as you have collected monies for this project, produced some, shipped some, but still owe an estimate 40+ units at 40 GBP a piece, so no you got money because people here who ordered a SIDE kept their side of the agreement and paid you. Now, if you are referring to your compensation for your time and effort that was your responsibility to figure that amount accurately, we cannot be held accountable for your under estimating your labor hours.

 

The "nerve" that you have spending countless hours on other forums sharing your works on other projects when all the while the SIDE is waiting for you to complete. Yes, you have "a lot of nerve" to complain when you are the one who has the SIDEs and peoples money, and most everyone here has been patiently waiting in hopes that you will be so kind to give them what they paid for months/year ago.

 

It is not your poorly written English that I'm having issues with but your actions Zaxon, for they speak the truth here. Stop complaining about how unfairly you feel this experience has been for you as we have given you time and encouragement, and in one case that I know of more money, so finish the SIDE as promised.

 

Mike

 

Note to All: I still have the list (voluntary) of people owed a SIDE. If you have received yours please post it here or send me a PM then I will update my list.

[+rdemming]

The bright news is that people are now receiving their UltraSatan. So he fulfilled those outstanding orders which hopefully will become the case for the SIDE as well.

 

I received my SIDE and DivIDE already a long time ago, and I'm very happy with Zaxon's work. Zaxon did a great job building them. It is too bad that his "project management skills" turned out not as good as his "soldering and building skills". But with the UltraSatans being delivered, I'm hopeful that the remaining SIDEs will be delivered soon as well and that the fun and usefulness of SIDE will (partly) make up for the long wait.

 

Robert

[UKRetrogamer]

Seriously guys? You've resorted to attacking each other now?

 

Why don't you all just take a step back from this and chill a little?

 

I ordered 2 SIDE units from Zaxon last year, spaced a few months apart. One device has already arrived and I'm waiting patiently for the other. At least Zaxon's staying in touch despite his knowledge of the English language being somewhat restricted.

 

The poor guy is being attacked left, right and center yet he's still promising to deliver the goods when many others would have told you all where to get off and closed up shop for good.

 

By replying here and risking FURTHER flak, Zaxon is showing he still cares. And for that, I'm grateful.

 

Other projects have missed their deadlines in the past and delays on one/two-man projects are sometimes inevitable. I paid for a 7800 XM last year but I'm not bitching about it. Neither am I complaining that my 2600 Boulder Dash cartridge is still to make a showing.

 

Grow up. It's NOT the end of the world. Wait until December 2012 when the end has been predicted. THEN complain!

 

If you want to experience a REAL rip-off, try ordering from Roger Taylor. He sells various devices and software for the Tandy Coco range of micros. TWO YEARS AGO, I paid roughly $100 for a MicroSD pack (card-based, floppy-emulation interface) and something called the Phoenix Development IDE from a site he owned at the time, coco3.com.

 

I should have done what others had done and clawed back my money through PayPal but I missed the deadline. I contacted Roger a handful of times. Roger made every excuse under the sun in response to my polite "nudges", before completely ignoring any further requests for status updates on my order and then disappearing COMPLETELY. This GOB-SHITE is STILL taking orders for his vapourware devices. Opening and closing domains to try to out-run his creditors.

 

ROGER'S excuses to me, ranged from issues with the supplier of his moulded plastic cases through BULLYING and verbal attacks by his only other competitor. I've never heard such prima-donna BS in my entire life! What a complete and UTTER TOSSER!

 

Now I hear Roger Taylor has been trying to sell his so-called "business" (including his DEBTS), just to stop customers attacking him.

 

So. If you think Zaxon is a bad guy here, you couldn't be more mistaken.

 

Zaxon, if you read this - Do your best to get the backlog of SIDE orders complete. Ignore those who are attacking you along with those who are intent on attacking others (WTF?). This will all blow over once you deliver your last SIDE units and then you can forget the whole, sorry tale and move on to other projects.

 

We live in a civilsed world. We're NOT savages. Guys? Let's behave like we belong in the urban world and not in a jungle...

Edited June 2, 2012 by UKRetrogamer

[flashjazzcat]

I fail to see how a vendor is doing everyone a special favour by keeping their customers in the loop. And that's if they were kept in the loop: it's worth noting the large periods of time which elapsed without any communication whatsoever being returned. Community spirit notwithstanding, once money changes hands, things change somewhat. Evidently what pissed people off here was seeing Zaxon promoting other hardware projects elsewhere on the Internet, while SIDE customers here went with emails unanswered and no information regarding the status of their orders, months after having placed them. If you can access the Internet to post videos and photos of your new project, you can answer the outstanding emails and PMs from people who put money into the previous project.

 

Certainly other projects have missed their deadlines, but one can live with that if the impression given is that the vendor is beavering away to get the project completed, to the exclusion of all other non-essential spare-time activities. The fact of the matter is, Zaxon is extremely lucky to have chosen an online retro computing community as his customer base. The patience and understanding that he has been afforded (along with indulgence of tales of personal woe) is not something one would see in a normal commercial transaction.

 

The relevance of Mr Taylor's misdemeanours here eludes me. Perhaps anyone who feels aggrieved about their SIDE's non-arrival should tune into "Rogue Traders" on TV in the hope that tales of botched plumbing and roof extensions and time-share villas overlooking building sites will make them feel - on balance - pretty lucky that an overdue SIDE cart is their only problem.

 

I don't want to pillory Zaxon: my personal dealings with Piotr have been nothing but pleasant. He provided me with all the hardware I needed when developing the SIDE software, and even gave me a CRT monitor. But I never handed the guy any money, and it's plain to see that - short of an irrational and motiveless witch-hunt being enacted here - not everyone else had such a positive experience. Emails and PMs having gone unanswered, customers came here to seek updates, vent, complain, etc.

 

I perceive - again without malice or prejudice - that Zaxon is also keen to turn the argument around and label some complainants' behaviour "disgusting". This is called rationalisation, and is an excellent way of asserting that certain paying customers are in fact such awful people that they deserved to wait longer for their order. One can then turn away from the hobby, battered, maligned, sell all your Atari equipment, and yet be confident that you remained the better person throughout... well, quite.

 

Certainly there are a few sub-plots running in the soap-opera here documented... some unrest among the crowd... but I see no justification for Zaxon (were he of a less temperate nature) to "tell everyone where to get off". What happened to "the customer's always right"? Surely common courtesy is what we should expect in a "civilised world".

 

In any case, I believe we have reached a stage here where all everyone wants is for the orders to be fulfilled as quickly as possible and without further trouble. In fact this has been the case since the first money changed hands. Actions speak louder than words. SIDEs on doormats are the only things which will quiesce the "savages".

[+Stephen]

Look UKR - I don't agree with attacking people. However, when you order something (especially as a pre-order on a supposedly finished product), and a year later still don't have it, all the while new ordered were sold and filled via Ebay, and other new projects were started, you have EVERY right to be pissed off and tell other people about it.

 

Bottom line - fill orders in the order they were paid for, don't start new projects and sell other stuff until your prior commitments have been fulfilled. Also, don't lie to me and tell me 4 different times my order has shipped when it hasn't even been built yet. It's a pretty simple concept.

[Faicuai]

We live in a civilsed world. We're NOT savages. Guys? Let's behave like we belong in the urban world and not in a jungle...

 

 

...Sorry from bringing you down from your comfy-hammock, hung between two coconut-trees who knows somewhere...

 

...But, NO, we do not exactly live in a "civilized" world, and (again), sorry if this thread is just your rude awakening, or you are simply slept-at-the-switch with what is REALLY going on here.

 

Time for you to do your homework, before resorting to public commiseration (which already happened here, and just made things worse).

[UKRetrogamer]

my personal dealings with Piotr have been nothing but pleasant. He provided me with all the hardware I needed when developing the SIDE software, and even gave me a CRT monitor. But I never handed the guy any money, and it's plain to see that - short of an irrational and motiveless witch-hunt being enacted here

So your valid reason for standing here, being so outspoken with a torch in one hand and a pitch-fork in the other is?..

 

I'm asking because in your own words, Piotr has been pleasant toward you, GIVEN you hardware and TAKEN NOTHING. Yet you're still here, adding your voice to the throng in the hope of seeing the guy hung from the highest tree?

 

If you remember, he's recently been in the unenviable postion of being forced to move to another country to find work, yet he still sticks his head up whenever he can to post updates, just to have someone else take a shot at him...

 

Seriously flashjazzcat, I genuinely appreciate what you've brought to this and other Atari home-brew projects but if (as you say) you're not owed anything by Zaxon, WHY are you here adding fuel to SOMEONE ELSE'S fire?

 

And did ANY of the accusers here EVER stop to think Piotr may not be responding to individual emails due to his poor grasp of the English language? Let's face it, each time he posts an update to this thread, some bright-spark disassembles it and COMPLETELY mis-interprets most of what he's trying to say!

[UKRetrogamer]

...But, NO, we do not exactly live in a "civilized" world

...So you're admitting to being uncivilized?

 

What have you REALLY lost here? Sum it up for me, please? It's my opinion nobody has lost anything yet. Zaxon is promising to make good on his orders.

 

He's taking his time - NOT YOUR FIRSTBORN!!!

 

I'm ALSO awaiting a SIDE device from Piotr but I'm NOT about to join your witch-hunt. What will this achieve other than driving away an obviously talented hardware designer who has designed and built amazing custom hardware which keeps our retro-hobby interesting and exciting?

 

Have some perspective, people!

Edited June 3, 2012 by UKRetrogamer

[Faicuai]

(...) What have you REALLY lost here? Sum it up for me, please? It's my opinion nobody has lost anything yet. (...)

 

...Since you seem totally unable, I will do it for you: I've lost my PATIENCE (and a FUSE), and, in return, he has lost most of his credibility.

 

 

Have some perspective, people!

 

...Let me try to help you, instead: why don't you open a survey-thread, asking those that ORDERED their SIDE cart, what they really think? There's your perspective, instead of your COMPLACENT and INEPTITUDE-TOLERANT posture.

 

Just don't blow my other fuse, as I'm sure it will not be pretty.

[UKRetrogamer]

I've lost my PATIENCE (and a FUSE), and, in return, he has lost most of his credibility.

...and there we have it.

 

As if your previous BIG BOLD COLOURFUL ACCUSATIONS OF FRAUD AND SCAM hadn't given that game away?..

 

Seriously? you don't think I could see that? I didn't need an SLR to see this. (Monkey accessorised or otherwise).

 

Let me try to help you, instead: why don't you open a survey-thread, asking those that ORDERED their SIDE cart, what they really think? There's your perspective, instead of your complacient and ineptitude-tolerant posture.

Ineptitude, huh? it would APPEAR I have a better handle on this situation than you at this juncture.

 

Re: the survey? Looks like I'll probably have my hands full, fighting off angry trolls for the time-being. Maybe another day but thanks for the idea...

 

Oh. and BTW, "complacient" is actually spelled COMPLACENT. You may not have noticed the little red wiggles under the incorrect spelling as more recently, you only appear able to write in FREAKING HUGE LETTERS.

[Faicuai]

 

(...)

 

Oh. and BTW, "complacient" is actually spelled COMPLACENT.

 

 

THANKS for posting something truly meaningful / useful.

 

I will go ahead and correct it, with an extra capitalized-and-bold-red boost...

[UKRetrogamer]

THANKS for posting something truly meaningful / useful.

 

I will go ahead and correct it, with an extra capitalized-and-bold-red boost...

Like the camera-mount BTW. What is it? A Goriila-Pod?

[atari8warez]

We live in a civilsed world. We're NOT savages. Guys? Let's behave like we belong in the urban world and not in a jungle...

 

In some of those "civilized" urban world, they would kill you for a few bucks..... and don't insult the "savages" please, they only kill to survive...

Edited June 3, 2012 by atari8warez

[atari8warez]

Seriously flashjazzcat, I genuinely appreciate what you've brought to this and other Atari home-brew projects but if (as you say) you're not owed anything by Zaxon, WHY are you here adding fuel to SOMEONE ELSE'S fire?

 

 

I think you are absolutely wrong thinking that Zaxon does not owe him anything. Zaxon not only owes him but he owes to the whole Atariage community a genuine apology and instead of rationalizing his situation (as fjk said) he should - in full speed - try to clear his name. The answer he should be given to the community here should be "I'll do everything in my power to make this right", instead of "I'll sell everything and get out of this". And one doesn't need an excellent command of English language to come up with that ONE sentence, all he needs is character, a strong one that is, unfortunately he seems to be lacking that big time.

Edited June 3, 2012 by atari8warez

[atari8warez]

What will this achieve other than driving away an obviously talented hardware designer who has designed and built amazing custom hardware which keeps our retro-hobby interesting and exciting?

 

Have some perspective, people!

 

Am I missing something here about his prowess of hardware design, let's see

 

SIDE - designed by Candle (I know Candle isn't Zaxon)

Ultrasatan - designed by Jookie (is jookie zaxon?)

sd2iec - Hardware/PCB design by Shadowolf.

netusbee - Lyndon Amsdon

 

I remember seeing other hardware advertised on his website but designed by other people.

 

So is he really the genuis you try to make him, or is he a (rather unsuccessful) builder/reseller of other people's designs.

Edited June 3, 2012 by atari8warez