Why isn't the 130XE the dominant Atari 8bit?

[zzip]

7 hours ago, Mercenary said:

I never cared for the 800XL either. I've tried to like the way the XL looks, but I can't warm to its the brown and cream, nor do I like its styling. But it's all personal taste, like you say.

I think it's a product of its period.   The XL line came along and announced "the 80s are here", and made the 800 and especially the 400 look like relics of the 70s.   The two-tone color is probably always going to be devisive.   I like it, but I don't think I'll ever warm to the Atari 400's looks.   

[reifsnyderb]

Actually, when it comes to looks, I like the XL line better.  It's more of a form over function issue for me.  The 800 looks like a typewriter...which is unnecessary.  The 400 looks like a shrunken 800.  So, they are similar.  The XL's, on the other hand, don't have much in the way of extra curves, angled keys, typewriter look, etc.  For the XL's, almost every part of the case has a purpose.  Sure, there is the two-tone look, metalic trim, and a few other styling issues.  But the XL's don't go overboard.  The XL's don't have extra curves just to put in a stylish curve.  The XL's are form over function.  The XE's, on the other hand, have angled console keys for no reason at all.  Then, the XE's have the top geometry, for the lack of a better term, that is all about styling and not about function.  For most people, the XE's just added funny console keys, more places for dust to collect, and screwed up the cartridge port. 

[_The Doctor__]

Atari hired some artistic 'talent' that came up with the XE/ST/GS/Jaguar cases... The Jaguar ended up looking like a Commogore toilet when it's CD unit is attached, and the XEGS got some roundness in the console keys, for geometric juxtaposition. Not exactly to the taste of most electronic minded people. But the XEGS was leg warmer people friendly, like totally.

Edited November 28, 2023 by _The Doctor__

[+mytek]

1 minute ago, _The Doctor__ said:

...the XEGS got some roundness in the console keys, for geometric juxtaposition. Not exactly to the taste of the electronic minded people.

At the time when the XEGS was released the TV show Miami Vice had been a big hit, which the pastel colors of those big round buttons kinda fell in line with the pastel color theme of that show. So it could be argued that Atari was in tune to the time period with it's choice of colors. Personally I like it

 

[zzip]

Yes, pastels were popular in the later 80s, due to Miami Vice.

 

I think the problem with the pastel buttons on XEGS is they clash in both shape and color with the rest of the XE design language.   If Atari wanted to incorporate pastels, they should have integrated other pastel and circular elements into the design to make it look like the buttons belonged there.

[+mytek]

Just now, zzip said:

I think the problem with the pastel buttons on XEGS is they clash in both shape and color with the rest of the XE design language.   If Atari wanted to incorporate pastels, they should have integrated other pastel and circular elements into the design to make it look like the buttons belonged there.

Agreed    But it still works for me.

 

And at least they put the cartridge on the top where it belongs. The other XE's with the back loading cartridge simply didn't make sense for something that needed to accommodate the number of cartridge swaps that would usually occur back before there was a multi-cart.

 

Also out of all the Atari systems, besides the 1200XL, there's a ton of head room inside for upgrades without keyboard clearance issues. However the super short cord kinda defeated the advantages of a detachable keyboard.

[reifsnyderb]

16 minutes ago, zzip said:

I think the problem with the pastel buttons on XEGS is they clash in both shape and color with the rest of the XE design language.

It also made the XEGS look more like a toy as opposed to a serious computer.

[Beeblebrox]

2 hours ago, reifsnyderb said:

It also made the XEGS look more like a toy as opposed to a serious computer.

I always wondered what possessed Atari to use those pastel colours on the console buttons. Now I have more of an idea why. Personally I'd have not baby blue and pink colours anywhere near a gaming console. I agree, makes it look like a toy, or a fisher price baby activity centre!

 

 

Okay, maybe not that bad.. heh heh!!

[+mytek]

3 hours ago, reifsnyderb said:

It also made the XEGS look more like a toy as opposed to a serious computer.

Well in a sense it was, being primarily aimed at being a new game console (which is kinda like a toy), and a computer 2nd

 

EDIT: Getting back to the main subject of this thread, the 130XE and all XEs for that matter had what I consider to be a 'toy' like mushy keyboard, and not something you would expect on a serious computer. Of course the Atari 400's membrane keyboard was definitely in full toy mode 

[Beeblebrox]

5 minutes ago, mytek said:

Well in a sense it was, being primarily aimed at being a new game console (which is kinda like a toy), and a computer 2nd

 

 

True. Although I never think of games consoles as toys... Or it makes me still a kid Heh Heh. I liked the colour scheme of the jag, even though with the jag cd it does look like toilet.

[+mytek]

2 minutes ago, Beeblebrox said:

Although I never think of games consoles as toys... Or it makes me still a kid Heh Heh.

Nothing wrong with that. Often times I think we all grew up and left behind the most genuine part of ourselves.

[zzip]

1 minute ago, Beeblebrox said:

True. Although I never think of games consoles as toys... Or it makes me still a kid Heh Heh. I liked the colour scheme of the jag, even though with the jag cd it does look like toilet.

I'd have to give the Tramiel Atari credit in that they produced attractive product designs more often than not, with some bizarre exceptions like the toilet JagCD and Easter Egg buttons on the XEGS.

[+mytek]

4 minutes ago, zzip said:

I'd have to give the Tramiel Atari credit in that they produced attractive product designs more often than not, with some bizarre exceptions like the toilet JagCD and Easter Egg buttons on the XEGS.

I agree. But this is one of those 'every one has a different view of what's attractive'. This is evident in so many things that people buy.

 

Speaking of a game console that looks like a toy, but still sold 1,000's.

 

And then there is this...

[+MrFish]

13 hours ago, Beeblebrox said:

I agree, makes it look like a toy, or a fisher price baby activity centre!

Hey, those activity centers are pretty cool. Most adults can't keep their hands off them either. 

 

[Joey Kay]

This thread is a lotta lotta fun.

 

In retrospect, I kinda wonder why I bought a 130XE over an XEGS when they cost the same.  For as little as I used that extra 64k, it would have been a better value proposition to get a light gun and the games over the extra memory.

 

Also, while taste is obviously personal, Atari really nailed the XEGS from both a design standpoint and a packaging standpoint.  Can't find a link offhand, but the design won some award at (I think) the 1987 International Toy Fair.

 

Anyhow, it really was all about the marketing for this 12-year-old.  I was buying a computer, not another game machine.  Got a few years of great fun out of my 130XE (and still pull it out from time-to-time), that is until Dad bought a Tandy 1000TL/2.

 

[Steril707]

Maybe it's just me, but I really feel that the pastel tones give a nice contrast to the grey of the XEGS.

Plus the lines on this thing scream late 80ies.

Reminds me a bit about this Yamaha Synth from back then:

 

 

Very nice design.

[+mytek]

7 hours ago, Joey Kay said:

Also, while taste is obviously personal, Atari really nailed the XEGS from both a design standpoint and a packaging standpoint.

I totally agree 👍

 

7 hours ago, Joey Kay said:

Can't find a link offhand, but the design won some award at (I think) the 1987 International Toy Fair.

Oh no you mentioned 'Toy', that's sure to get the hairs up on the back of someone's neck for sure. Personally in my opinion a Game Console is a toy. Not that it's a bad thing. But let's be realistic, if it's not a tool or a means to access or create information, and is predominately used for playing games - it's a toy. Maybe a toy that adults and kids also use, but still a toy 

 

EDIT: if you predominately use your XEGS mainly for other uses besides playing games, then it's more like a tool in that case.

[+bf2k+]

On 11/28/2023 at 11:23 AM, reifsnyderb said:

For most people, the XE's just added funny console keys, more places for dust to collect, and screwed up the cartridge port. 

Don't forget the shitty keyboard... 

[reifsnyderb]

Just now, bf2k+ said:

Don't forget the shitty keyboard... 

Thanks for reminding me!  Add "especially the shitty keyboard" to my list. 

 

Yeah, I don't really care for the XE.  I really only bought one to get it working with the 1090XL and 1091XL.

[Atari8guy]

On 11/28/2023 at 1:28 AM, Mercenary said:

 I never saw the ST as a failure. At least it wasn't in the UK. The ST, along with the Amiga, were a big deal in the mid to late 80s. It should've done better on the other side of the pond though. Atari certainly dropped the ball from the mid 80s onwards.

This is fair - failure - for either product line was probably a poor word choice.  Both products are successes, but they could have been even better with a little more effort on distribution.