+Larry Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 Hi Lee- Can you provide a couple of examples of applications or situations where MEM.SAV doesn't work on 4.50? I must admit that mostly I've just used it with cartridge programming and I never noticed that it didn't work. Never works? Works unreliably? Only works with BASIC/Assembler-type files under a cartridge environment (as opposed to BLOAD)? I now use 4.55 B4 all the time, but I've not seen the problems with the earlier versions that some other folks evidently have. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Hi Larry, I see now that the full breakdown actually only happens when using the K. SAVE file option under those mentioned versions. For more standard uses like BASIC or cartridge environment, the write mem.sav file and the read in mem.sav code can work as is there as that code was never moved to DUP.SYS. So it would be more accurate to say it's only half broken sometimes. Here is the boo-boo in 4.50. 010150 ; 010160 ; Subroutines moved from resident code: 010170 ; 010180 ; SAVE MEMORY SUBROUTINE: WRITE FILE BODY, 010190 ; INIT AND RUN VECTORS 010200 ; 42E8 010210 WDR 42E8 20881B 010220 JSR LDMEM ; LOAD MEM.SAV IF NEEDED At this point, this code and all of DUP.SYS no longer exists because it's just been overwritten by the mem.sav file. Oopsie. It is a combination string of code also used to write parts of the 6 byte header file info and the exact point of when that part should be cleaved from the K. SAVE file function isn't so clear since you can input init and run vectors for the end of the file where this same routine does that job too. Both header load address and end load addresses and init, start vectors are derived, set up and written by this same code. To complicate things even further the temp storage for these vectors are also used to store the Cartridge's init, and run vectors for fire up later by DOS.SYS. Obviously if the code is no longer there how can it possibly do it's job correctly? The rest of the mem.sav file system does work pretty much as expected, we just have severe problems when trying to use K. SAVE file in particular. And that is a requirement to build the properly modified Disk Master file. There are more mistakes made with the K. SAVE file code that I see now, been lucky beta 4 works for this one example in fact. I know you've reported no problems before, I did not see how that was even a possibility then, but now I do. If you never used K. SAVE file before you might not have any problems at all. Not sure I would exactly trust it myself, but it sure COULD work fine. Just noticed the first line in the code box is lower case which is usually Puff's comments - this may have been done by Puff? Nobody's perfect? Giving it more thought reviewing this post, BASIC must fire itself off from it's own init and run vectors after crashing at this code? And this may be the trouble with MyDOS where it does NOT like it when one boots to DOS, runs a program to turn on the BASIC cartridge and then one tries to B. Run Cartridge. MyDOS usually crashes at this point but beta 4 is no exception so now I really don't know what to think !! But there are more parts to the puzzle than there were before - thanks for that. I think. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+therealbountybob Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 Reporting back! I've been checking out many of these editors (on real hardware) as I hack into a popular game. Not found anything as "good"/ easy to use as Disky II - probably Disk Wizard II is next best on my list of favourites - the disassembler is nice, especially now I can use APE to capture and print the output. Diskey needs the translator to run on the XE and the slight delay on the key presses is a bit aggravating - though there are many features here. I really like Disk Magic's ability to disassemble the sector you are viewing. Disk Master is ok but I can't see a multi sector search. Sector Surgeon has two windows showing Internal and ASCII but no hex search and seems to go into a loop reading the disk if you accidentally enter a 0 but it does let you access the higher sectors. Black Disk is a bit painful to use. The other one I have is called "Sector 8" which is in BASIC but has some very interesting features - can't work them all out (will post it sometime as I can't remember seeing it). Still a few more to check out DISKY II For Disky II I found it a pain that I couldn't press reset to reboot so I "fixed" this - change Sector 15 Byte 0D from CA to EA (way to go eh?!) - this saved turning the Atari on and off after each bunch of hacks to test the game Instead of reset you can abort many commands by entering 0 as the sector number. Another thing I forgot to say was you can press D as the disk is booting and Disky II will run immediately I would still really really like a 1050 version of Disky II (and a file version if possible)? (I don't know anything about the disks' format) Disky II was one of those in my collection, I had used Disk Wizard II for a while but this was so much easier for editing disk sectors [single key press operations] - After changing text, I mainly used to add extra lives. Disky II.png I've been through my Atari stuff but no luck so I've created a new summary: A Ascii Search (prompts for "FMS Y/N", excludes searching the sectors 126-128) C Copy from Sector D Dec Value (converts to hex) F Format (prompted to confirm. single density only) H Hex Value (converts to decimal) M Modify (Use Tab to move cursor. Start to exit. Prompted to write) N New Sector # R Read Sector S Hex Search W Write X Hex Mask (enter 00 to clear) - Read Previous Sector * + Read Next Sector * * The neat thing is you can double tap the key and the sectors will keep reading until you press a key. BREAK aborts any prompts RESET aborts all commands but does not re-read the sector or clear any masks. If anyone does patch Disky II (or Disk Wizard II) for 1050 enhanced density and formatting that would be welcomed. I'll stick my neck out and say I'd be suprised if the others are as good I've got another one with some unusual features somewhere (will see if I can find it). p.s. Checkout sector #49 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Allan Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 I don't know if this book would be any help but here it is. Advanced Atari Protection Techniques English - 1986 - 176 p. Alpha Systems http://www.atarimania.com/documents/Advanced_Atari_Protection_Techniques.pdf Allan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+CharlieChaplin Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 (edited) Well, at pigwa in the Holmes collection there are two images of Diskey II, one is named Diskey II DD.ATR, the other one is named Diskey II ED.ATR Have not tested these images yet, but maybe the ED.ATR is what you want... http://ftp.pigwa.net/stuff/collections/holmes%20cd/Holmes%201/ATR%20Programs/Applications%20A-Z/index.html Both images come on a 64k image (the shortest image that is possible with SIO2PC). Used Super-Copy by Peter Jakubek and turned the DiskeyED bootdisk into a DOS file - try it and report back if its usefull or not... DiskeyED.zip Edited August 23, 2015 by CharlieChaplin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup8pdct Posted August 23, 2015 Share Posted August 23, 2015 I have been messing with the Black Box rom and have managed to extract Task master disk editor and save it as a stand alone program. Please note that it will kill any dos as it was never meant to be loaded from dos, but it does exit with a cold boot. Use XL/XE os and no basic. It may with other os but haven't tested it. task.atr James 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 (edited) It works for me... somewhat.... appears to work when first run but subsequent reset and reboot causes it to fail. I have to power off for a clean reboot to make it work again... Sometimes I perform arrow to sector or previous next sector and it does not refresh the screen with new data... so a power off reboot is needed to make it perform again... What rev BB firmware is it from? would it be possible to allow it to copy ram it is about to occupy to highest location in mem then put it back on exit or same idea using a third disk parameter to mem save to perhaps MIO ram, ram disk, or real drive... that would make it act much more like the bb in how the bb swapped it in and out using it's own ram. Awesome first crack at it... I have firmware 1.34, 1.41, 1.41s I no longer have the enhancer spooler mod as my floppy board has never returned to me and had to revert back to standard. Edited August 28, 2015 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+therealbountybob Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 Well, at pigwa in the Holmes collection there are two images of Diskey II, one is named Diskey II DD.ATR, the other one is named Diskey II ED.ATR Have not tested these images yet, but maybe the ED.ATR is what you want... Both images come on a 64k image (the shortest image that is possible with SIO2PC). Used Super-Copy by Peter Jakubek and turned the DiskeyED bootdisk into a DOS file - try it and report back if its usefull or not... Thanks for posting but it seem to be the same, only let you go up to sector 720 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballyalley Posted August 28, 2015 Author Share Posted August 28, 2015 I was glancing through a pdf version of "Antic" magazine yesterday when I came across a recommendation for another Disk Editor ("DISKIO" by Robert Gray). This disk utility hasn't been mentioned in this thread yet. The review for the program is in "Antic" Vol 6, no.10 (February 1988) on page 36. It's given high marks in Charles Cherry's column called "8-Bit Enhancements." I OCRed the review: "DISKIO"Get out your checkbook and order this program right now. Everyone needs a good disk editor and "DISKIO" stands head and shoulders above the rest. This is the program you will reach for when a file gets trashed, when you get the dreaded ERROR 164 (file number mismatch), when you drip peanut butter on your floppy, or when any of the myriad of disk horrors befalls you.Do not confuse this product with Antic's "DISKIO" (January 1985) and "DISKIO Plus" (December 1985). Those type-in programs are DOS extensions that make DOS friendlier and more powerful. Robert Gray's "DISKIO" is a disk repair and editing utility. And it is the best one I have ever seen.DISKIO does all the normal repair, editing and copying functions. It displays sectors in Hexadecimal, ATASCII or screen codes. It supports normal, extended and double density. It also supports RAMdisks (DOS 2.5, MYDOS, Omnimon, Axlon, XE, expanded XL/XE), hard disks, and 8" disks, including subdirectories. It automatically repairs ERROR 164s and rebuilds directories.I could quibble over a couple of minor points, the disk map could be more informative, an automatic VTOC repair is missing, as is a sector copier. But, over all, "DISKIO" is reasonably complete and very easy to use. Even the documentation is pretty good, although if you're a novice, you should read the last half of the instructions before the first half.$26, 48K disk. Robert Gray, 123 N. Summit, Little Rock, AR 72205. (501) 374-5400. AtariMania does have and entry for "DISKIO" by Omegasoft and programmed by Robert Gray. The 40-page manual is archived, but the disk is missing:http://www.atarimania.com/utility-atari-400-800-xl-xe-diskio_30226.html Although I couldn't find the program archived anywhere, the manual and disk for this program were recently sold on ebay for $9.00. Here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Atari-8-Bit-Diskio-By-Robert-Gray-Tested-Working-Disk-Manual-/331620127223?rmvSB=true&nma=true&si=CY4ZZZkZLSONuMyUfM7O64n%252B2Us%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 Maybe whoever bought it will archive it soon? Has anyone "DISKIO" before? Has this been disk editor been archived anyplace else? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup8pdct Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 It is from version 1.61. I have got it to read sector 65535 When you change disks, you will need to press the drive number of the disk that has changed so the program reads the percom block of the drive to know what size it is. [shift] drive number sets destination drive. Taskmaster does have problems even when run from the BB menu. James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup8pdct Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 I have dissembled taskmaster. The first thing taskmaster does is to turn off the BB rom. No other reference is made to BB rom or to BB hardware registers any where that I can find. It very strongly suggests that Taskmaster is a stand alone program. Maybe clearing ram from $400 to $97FF may help. James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 (edited) @sup8pdct That's good information, could you dump the complete 1.61 rom, I think Mathy might add it to his repository and list... off hand do you know the differences between 1.61 and the other roms? I will try two different things then, use different loading and clearing the ram locations from $400 to $97FF... Thank you once more! -The Doctor__ Edited September 1, 2015 by _The Doctor__ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup8pdct Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 I must apologize for a gaff i made re rom version. Rom version is 2.16, not 1.61 Pays me not to double check and solely rely on memory. Me = no longer young James 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariGeezer Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 I've used DISKEY quite often in the 80's examining floppies. You can find these on ebay now and then with the manual for < $20. I also just bought DiskWiz-II with the manual on ebay, which I'll scan so Allan can post it to Atarimania Just uploaded the PDF to Atarimania ftp://ftp.atarimania.com/8bit/DiskWiz-II.pdf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballyalley Posted December 3, 2015 Author Share Posted December 3, 2015 Just uploaded the PDF to Atarimania ftp://ftp.atarimania.com/8bit/DiskWiz-II.pdf I am prompted for a name and password in order to download this program from the AtariMania FTP site. Shouldn't these docs be added to this page: http://www.atarimania.com/utility-atari-400-800-xl-xe-diskwiz-ii_19712.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariGeezer Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Shouldn't these docs be added to this page: http://www.atarimania.com/utility-atari-400-800-xl-xe-diskwiz-ii_19712.html Only a couple of people here have that kind of access, you'll have to wait until they can do that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Allan Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 Here it is. Allan DiskWiz-II.pdf.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballyalley Posted December 5, 2015 Author Share Posted December 5, 2015 Here it is. Allan Thanks for adding this. It seems that page 1 and 2 are missing. Page 3, the first page in the pdf with instructions, starts off in the middle of a sentence with, "[...] change on the screen." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariGeezer Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Thanks for adding this. It seems that page 1 and 2 are missing. Page 3, the first page in the pdf with instructions, starts off in the middle of a sentence with, "[...] change on the screen." Oops, looks like that pic didn't get added. I'll fix that today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariGeezer Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 (edited) Re-uploaded the PDF to Atarimania ftp://ftp.atarimania.com/8bit/Disk-WizII.pdf This one is 12 megs... Edit: I also cleaned it up a bit and resized the width of the pages... Edited December 5, 2015 by AtariGeezer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ac.tomo Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 I know it's by far not the best way, but what I used to use was Diskey II. I used to know all the hexadecimal codes, and so could follow the flow of the program as through the visual a sector-editor gives you. It's handy to have a copy of "Mapping the Atari - Revised" to hand and also a Machine-code/Assembly reference sheet giving you all of the Machine-Language codes and Assembly equivalents on a quick view card. Virtually all of my Demo's were created this way; Firstly, I would create the routine in BASIC & Assembly (a combination of the two) on paper, check thru it (in my head), double-check it thru, then convert the BASIC parts into Assembly, then enter it directly into the sector-editor. Obviously, no matter how hard one tries, you will always get bugs, which need ironing out (and I understand by coding your routines directly into a sector-editor this way quite possibly creates a few more bugs), but anyway, once the code was correct & bug free, I would write that back down onto paper for keeping, Or use a Dis-assembler to print it. Also, if I believe correctly, I think Diskey II was the one I used to access 720 & 1040 sectors (just not 720 Double-Density sectors), although I did have a Diskey version for D/D, even, though, with the amount of Double-Density utilities around it's not really any problem to convert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fujidude Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Re-uploaded the PDF to Atarimania ftp://ftp.atarimania.com/8bit/Disk-WizII.pdf This one is 12 megs... Edit: I also cleaned it up a bit and resized the width of the pages... Tried the link, asks for credentials. I didn't have them. What to use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Allan Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Here's the second version with the missing pages. Allan Disk-WizII.pdf.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariGeezer Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Tried the link, asks for credentials. I didn't have them. What to use? http://atariage.com/forums/topic/206315-bookyour-atari-8-bit-comes-alive-wdisk/?do=findComment&comment=2659375 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fujidude Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 Thanks AG and Allan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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