Keatah Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 If you don't put the dumpers in the dumps they'll put YOU in the dumps! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swami Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 If you don't put the dumpers in the dumps they'll put YOU in the dumps! "she's got a nice dumper" - Raising Hope 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Someone just needs to sell pre-packaged Raspberry Pi systems like this. Plug and play, no end-user setup, as the emulation on that board is rock solid. I wouldn't mine seeing something like a CanaKit, in retrogaming flavor. Perhaps it could be like the regular CanaKit and include a controller, some connectors, maybe some other doodads and instructions geared toward setting up emulators. I'm old-school and loved building those RadioShack project kits. A little bit of assembly goes a long way into making something your own. Even if it's non-technical like screwing things together and loading software or setting something up. It's called kit building! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Thag Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 But... there is another choice available. It arrived yesterday. It's sitting next to my TV right now. I played Demon Attack and Spider Fighter on it this morning. It was fun, I had a good time. Heh, same. Glad to see someone else is enjoying theirs. I like mine. It needs work, but I have faith it will get there. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Jentzsch Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Heh, same. Glad to see someone else is enjoying theirs. I like mine. It needs work, but I have faith it will get there. Agreed, it's cool IF it works. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 If you don't put the dumpers in the dumps they'll put YOU in the dumps! "she's got a nice dumper" - Raising Hope You know, another word for dump is crap. And I'm using the polite term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iesposta Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Stella Dev StephenA is posting a new 3.9.3 later tonight. It will fix the 1 thing that is saved and useful in the configure file - remembering the 16:9 or 4:3. It can still be corrupted, however simply turning off the RetroN 77 and back on and selecting a display ratio will save an uncorrupted configure. That means everything will work, a corrupted file will not cause any playing problems - it just will not remember the 16:9 or 4:3. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Thag Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Agreed, it's cool IF it works. I was actually playing Thrust on it last night. Forgotten how much I liked that game, so thanks for that. Yeah, if they can just get some of the kinks worked out, this gizmo shows real promise. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarifan88 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) Am I the only one who wonders why they released the Retron 77 if it still had plenty of bugs in it? Granted, they can be fixed, but why give the public something that doesn't have problems right out of the box. The average consumer isn't going to know how to fix these things on their own let alone want to be bothered with firmware updates every month or so. I agree it's nice to have that flexibility, but I figured something like the fire button issue would have been fixed early in testing. Edited July 13, 2018 by atarifan88 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swami Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Am I the only one who wonders why they released the Retron 77 if it still had plenty of bugs in it? Granted, they can be fixed, but why give the public something that doesn't have problems right out of the box. The average consumer isn't going to know how to fix these things on their own let alone want to be bothered with firmware updates every month or so. I agree it's nice to have that flexibility, but I figured something like the fire button issue would have been fixed early in testing. Casual gamer and multiple firmware updates dont seem to go together in my mind. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarifan88 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Casual gamer and multiple firmware updates dont seem to go together in my mind. Right, well I consider myself a die hard Atari gamer and still I don't want to deal with that mess! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) Even though I play these old Atari games only once in a while, I'm anything but a casual gamer. I take my gaming very seriously. I can't deal with the sort of interruptions a compatibility list causes, let alone wonky fire buttons or a console that won't load a game straight away. And no matter how much I abused my first VCS in 1977-1979, it continued working. It only stopped when I got into it with tools and starting taking parts out for other "projects". The R77 breaks if you hold the controller wrong, or power it off incorrectly. Shit. How DO you power something off..? You hit the switch, bam, it's powered off! That should not break anything under any circumstance. Edited July 13, 2018 by Keatah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarifan88 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 I think some of us expect it to work out of the box because that's how the Atari 2600 was back in the day. I don't think hose expectations are too high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaltran Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Absolutely. And lack of interest in half-baked products like Retron 77 or some of the FlashBacks is to be expected. It is literally Cheap Chinese Junk! Look at the edges of the PCB on the R77 and compare them against the PCB edges in a vintage VCS built in 1977. And note the solder quality and quantity. Just because there's a 2018 AllWinner quad-core chip in doesn't mean it's cool. the Mali GPU design is quite dated and not compatible with the necessary standards to make for good emulation. Wasn't the Mali designed for 2005-era (pre-smartphone) phones? There are many cost-cutting, corner-cutting, things going on in this console. But that's enough for now. --- You know, there's another thing. How come no one is complaining about the razor sharp images and pixels rendered by this? Yet people complained (and continue to do so) that Software Emulation on the PC is harsh with sharp edges. It's 100% the same damned thing here! You have a PC emulator outputting unfiltered, sharp, harsh edges. Does "because cartridges" suddenly make it all better? Mmmhmm.. --- As far as building a modern VCS today, it's eminently doable, and the basic groundwork has been done in FPGA already. Several times over. AND in the Software Emulation camp, Stella got a shot of increased accuracy this year. And sound is up for improvement next, I hear. Not that it's bad to begin with. There are several ways to go about making a modern-day VCS. You could have recreation/simulation of the original circuitry. You could even build limited editions using old-stock or (somehow) reclaimed TIA chips. Or even a non-gimmicky console around Stella itself. So when will you have it ready? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+stephena Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 OK, here's my second revision of the latest Stella 3.9.3 firmware. After applying, you can tell by looking at the license file; it should say "Using Stella 3.9.3 (rev 2)". Changes are as follows: Fix corrupt Stella config file on improper shutdown Fix 16:9/4:3 toggle sometimes not sticking Remove '0' text from state load/save (minor cosmetic change) Here is the file: r77_stella-3.9.3_rev2.zip Note that you have to unzip this, and copy the resulting files (uImage and License.bin) to the root folder on the SD card, overwriting the ones already there. For anyone that is interested, here are the specifics of what was going wrong, and how it was fixed. --------------------------------------------------- Stella is like any normal app or computer OS; if you shut it down improperly, it won't save its settings (or it will corrupt the settings file). One of the settings controls mapping for the joystick fire button. So if the file is corrupted, Stella generates a new generic one, that will have lost the mappings for this specific device. So when you then restore the original image, it uses the original config file that has the correct mapping, and everything works again (until the next crash). With the new code, we realize that almost none of the settings are actually changeable on this hardware, so it makes sense to not allow settings to ever be saved (and hence never be corrupted). The one exception is the 'fullscreen' option, which determines whether to use 16:9 or 4:3 mode. So this new code saves only that setting. Joystick mapping can never be screwed up, since the mapping is hardcoded into Stella for this device. Also, this fixes another bug, where sometimes toggling the 16:9/4:3 mode didn't stick. Try playing a game, toggling the setting, then immediately powering off. The setting would not be saved, since Stella was killed before its settings could be saved. With the new code, each time the toggle is done, the change is immediately written to the SD card. So powering off afterwards will have no effect on it. --------------------------------------------------- So, that is basically all I will be doing for Stella on this device in the immediate future. We now have the latest 3.x version (3.9.3), and fixes for corrupt files and losing the joystick fire button (which is arguably more important that having the latest Stella version). Barring any huge bugs in Stella 3.9.3, I will now return to Stella 5 development. We've created a Retron77 wiki which explains how to work on this hardware, and what is required to get it all updated. It is quite a bit of work. I may (and I stress this heavily) come back to this after the next major version of Stella is released, perhaps at the end of the summer or later. But only if I find time and motivation. In the meantime, I strongly urge either Hyperkin or some interested 3rd party to look into our research, and attempt to get Stella 5 working on this device. Good luck, Steve A. Stella maintainer EDIT: You also have to delete your old 'stellarc' file. This is very important. 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SIO2 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) There are several ways to go about making a modern-day VCS. You could have recreation/simulation of the original circuitry. You could even build limited editions using old-stock or (somehow) reclaimed TIA chips. Somehow reclaimed: Dark alley. Gun point. "Give me your TIA chip and nobody gets hurt." Several ways: Hand the Chinese an original Atari and tell them $20 each one like this. Edited July 13, 2018 by SIO2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaltran Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 OK, here's my second revision of the latest Stella 3.9.3 firmware. After applying, you can tell by looking at the license file; it should say "Using Stella 3.9.3 (rev 2)". Changes are as follows: Fix corrupt Stella config file on improper shutdown Fix 16:9/4:3 toggle sometimes not sticking Remove '0' text from state load/save (minor cosmetic change) Here is the file: r77_stella-3.9.3_rev2.zip Note that you have to unzip this, and copy the resulting files (uImage and License.bin) to the root folder on the SD card, overwriting the ones already there. For anyone that is interested, here are the specifics of what was going wrong, and how it was fixed. --------------------------------------------------- Stella is like any normal app or computer OS; if you shut it down improperly, it won't save its settings (or it will corrupt the settings file). One of the settings controls mapping for the joystick fire button. So if the file is corrupted, Stella generates a new generic one, that will have lost the mappings for this specific device. So when you then restore the original image, it uses the original config file that has the correct mapping, and everything works again (until the next crash). With the new code, we realize that almost none of the settings are actually changeable on this hardware, so it makes sense to not allow settings to ever be saved (and hence never be corrupted). The one exception is the 'fullscreen' option, which determines whether to use 16:9 or 4:3 mode. So this new code saves only that setting. Joystick mapping can never be screwed up, since the mapping is hardcoded into Stella for this device. Also, this fixes another bug, where sometimes toggling the 16:9/4:3 mode didn't stick. Try playing a game, toggling the setting, then immediately powering off. The setting would not be saved, since Stella was killed before its settings could be saved. With the new code, each time the toggle is done, the change is immediately written to the SD card. So powering off afterwards will have no effect on it. --------------------------------------------------- So, that is basically all I will be doing for Stella on this device in the immediate future. We now have the latest 3.x version (3.9.3), and fixes for corrupt files and losing the joystick fire button (which is arguably more important that having the latest Stella version). Barring any huge bugs in Stella 3.9.3, I will now return to Stella 5 development. We've created a Retron77 wiki which explains how to work on this hardware, and what is required to get it all updated. It is quite a bit of work. I may (and I stress this heavily) come back to this after the next major version of Stella is released, perhaps at the end of the summer or later. But only if I find time and motivation. In the meantime, I strongly urge either Hyperkin or some interested 3rd party to look into our research, and attempt to get Stella 5 working on this device. Good luck, Steve A. Stella maintainer Thank you very much, works great, I am testing with a bunch of games right now..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SIO2 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Here is the file: r77_stella-3.9.3_rev2.zip Bless you. Just out of curiosity, what is the proper shutdown procedure for Retron 77 then? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+stephena Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 I assume that shutdown is just turning it off, like a real console. It is impossible to 'brick' the OS or filesystem itself, since it is never saved to the SD card (it is all in RAM). The only thing that can possibly be corrupted is things that are written to the SD card. And the only thing doing that was Stella config file. Now that that issue is taken care of, nothing should be adversely affected by just turning the system off. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarifan88 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Bless you. Just out of curiosity, what is the proper shutdown procedure for Retron 77 then? That's what I was going to ask or how do you improperly shut it down there there is a button labeled power?! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+stephena Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 I should also add that if the 'joystick fire button stops working' bug is being caused by Stella config file being corrupted, then this is now fixed. I have re-created that issue, and dealt with it. However, if there are other ways in which this bug can happen (hardware bugs, etc), then it may pop up again. I only fixed the problems caused by incorrect usage of Stella, and AFAIK this is the only way for the bug to occur. But I guess we won't know until more testing is done. If the problems are deeper than Stella (hardware, kernel, etc), then Hyperkin will have to fix it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+xucaen Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 That's what I was going to ask or how do you improperly shut it down there there is a button labeled power?! This is just a guess on my part but I suspect removing the cartridge while the unit is powered on might have caused Stella to improperly shut down. I saw some weird glitches, including the fire button bug, when attempting to hot swap cartridges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shipwreck Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 I was able to get Choplifter and River Raid to work by not inserting them completely into the slot. So, happy that they are able to work - 2 of my favorite games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+swlovinist Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Am I the only one who wonders why they released the Retron 77 if it still had plenty of bugs in it? Granted, they can be fixed, but why give the public something that doesn't have problems right out of the box. The average consumer isn't going to know how to fix these things on their own let alone want to be bothered with firmware updates every month or so. I agree it's nice to have that flexibility, but I figured something like the fire button issue would have been fixed early in testing. Absolutely my honest thoughts too. Even an additional 3 months and have this released in the 4th quarter with some updates might have been a better move. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBeefy Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Someone just needs to sell pre-packaged Raspberry Pi systems like this. Plug and play, no end-user setup, as the emulation on that board is rock solid. That said, I'm fine with the Retron 77 taking a bit to get right. I knew what I was getting. This is how Hyperkin operates, they are nice people, but very small time. It'll get there. I played Draconian not long ago on mine. They really aren't hard to do. Hell i have used an image of my SD to help make 3 setups for other people. I can make an image and then copy and write it to a mew micro sd. It is only a problem if their sd is slightly smaller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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