Is the Amico dead?

[Rev]

41 minutes ago, MrBeefy said:

Yes I know it's a trash NES game but it's a classic with my family!

 

Ive actually never played it.  

[MrBeefy]

1 hour ago, Rev said:

Ive actually never played it.  

It's.........interesting. It's F13 but not F13 at all. 

[Cebus Capucinis]

Oh man imagine a F13 game on Amico....

 

Wouldn't That Be Something?™️

[phoenixdownita]

On 3/25/2022 at 9:01 AM, mr_me said:

If two players are close to each other skill wise, you wouldn't want game balancing effects just because one is losing.  That's a competitive game.  If one player is destroying the other, than the weaker player is not being competitive.  That's when it can be used.

So, to put it in plain English the Karma Engine was meant to step in during "uncooperative and anticompetitive play" .... little bit like MS.
(mind you even "anticooperative and uncompetitive play" does not sound all that much better)

It obviously has to be a game by game decision, as mentioned elsewhere Mario Kart does it and imho a little too much in most recent incarnations.

<note>yes the above is more of a joke but when you put it into words like the above the (now declared a marketing device) Karma Engine does sound funny</note>   

 

also as we all know "karma's a bitch"

[mr_me]

The karma engine balancing is implemented in each game program but you can have global settings and data to help determine when it's activated.

[+Lathe26]

On 3/25/2022 at 8:17 AM, MrBeefy said:

... Word is they had a chance to secure everything at $150 and make $100 per console and passed up on that.

...

I have heard of no such word, even as a rumor.  Do you have any references for this?

 

Clarification: this is in reference to that IE passed up on securing these $ amounts, not whether these were idealized targets that IE stated earlier on.

[MrBeefy]

3 hours ago, Lathe26 said:

I have heard of no such word, even as a rumor.  Do you have any references for this?

 

Clarification: this is in reference to that IE passed up on securing these $ amounts, not whether these were idealized targets that IE stated earlier on.

If I track down the video I will tag you. Someone talked with a possible manufacturer. It was hinted that the prices were around that amount. Basically the story was they could have secured the parts to make a decent profit. Passed to find cheaper then pandemic hit and that was no longer an option. I think it was a one stop shop too.

[MrBeefy]

6 hours ago, mr_me said:

The karma engine balancing is implemented in each game program but you can have global settings and data to help determine when it's activated.

It doesn't have "global settings". 

[MrBeefy]

6 hours ago, Lathe26 said:

 

Here's the video.

 

[mr_me]

2 hours ago, MrBeefy said:

It doesn't have "global settings". 

They can implement it however they want, global control, per game setting, or both. If it only happens in more extreme situations it could probably be on all the time.

Edited March 27, 2022 by mr_me

[Matt_B]

I think they'd have been better off creating an engine that could balance late and overbudget consoles into coming out.

[Cebus Capucinis]

I mean they did create a "beg for more millions" engine but it appears it has several critical bugs in the code.

[+Lathe26]

3 hours ago, MrBeefy said:

Here's the video.

 

Thanks, I put it in my watchlist to check it out later.

[Matt_B]

3 minutes ago, Cebus Capucinis said:

I mean they did create a "beg for more millions" engine but it appears it has several critical bugs in the code.

Chris Roberts has that one and he's not sharing.

[Cebus Capucinis]

5 hours ago, MrBeefy said:

If I track down the video I will tag you. Someone talked with a possible manufacturer. It was hinted that the prices were around that amount. Basically the story was they could have secured the parts to make a decent profit. Passed to find cheaper then pandemic hit and that was no longer an option. I think it was a one stop shop too.

That event might be connected to the Ark contract claim, I just realized. Perhaps going to that manufacturer and trying to strike a deal was what breached the (theoretical) exclusivity clause in the Ark contract (if that did, indeed happen). Hmmm.

 

Or they passed on that manufacturer for cheaper, couldn't find cheaper so signed with Ark, then went "hey let's go back to that previous offer and hope it's still on the table...."

 

If any of that did happen, what a stark example of "bird in the hand is worth two in the bush."

[MrBeefy]

1 hour ago, Cebus Capucinis said:

That event might be connected to the Ark contract claim, I just realized. Perhaps going to that manufacturer and trying to strike a deal was what breached the (theoretical) exclusivity clause in the Ark contract (if that did, indeed happen). Hmmm.

 

Or they passed on that manufacturer for cheaper, couldn't find cheaper so signed with Ark, then went "hey let's go back to that previous offer and hope it's still on the table...."

 

If any of that did happen, what a stark example of "bird in the hand is worth two in the bush."

It was pretty irresponsible either way. It is kind of a slap in the face for them have recently held out their hands and begged for more. They obviously don't know how to effectively use money. Why anyone thinks it's a good idea to freely give them money is beyond me. If they believe in it themselves maybe they should put up their houses or retirements instead of asking others?

[Keatah]

This Karma Krap sounds like another unnecessary complexity. Just give me a simple straightforward game like Triple Action!

 

That's what most gamers are asking for, yet companies don't seem to hear.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Keatah

[Keatah]

On 3/22/2022 at 3:40 PM, Matt_B said:

Something just feels off about being able to play a game without ever breaking the shrink wrap. That's a big part of the ritual.

Shrinkwrap my emulaterz!

[kevtris]

45 minutes ago, Keatah said:

This Karma Krap sounds like another unnecessary complexity. Just give me a simple straightforward game like Triple Action!

 

That's what most gamers are asking for, yet companies don't seem to hear.

Ironically, Intellivision broke up Triple Action into three "Single Action" games.  Though I think only two of those games got worked on, and after the stolen assets debacle, the tank game hasn't been seen since.  It probably should've been kept as triple action;  I don't think a game like Biplanes can stand on its own for the $10 entry fee.

[Keatah]

On 3/21/2022 at 5:37 PM, Albert said:

I think the main issues are not having a keyboard, and some (many) games probably have UI elements and/or text that don't work very well on a screen of that size.

Rightsizing of text on whatever screen is in use is a huge sleeper factor. It's gotta be done right or else causes fatigue.

 

Like the original score counters in the first Atari 2600 games. Big, clear (for the technology at the time), colorful.

 

On 3/21/2022 at 3:01 PM, Noah98 said:

I'd like to see them redesign the console and make it more like the Evercade.

I just want to see simplification. No need for NFT or LCD controllers or anything "online". Really! We don't want it!

 

Quote

It should absolutely be cartridge based and scrap the online shop idea. They probably don't have the resources and infrastructure right now to support an online shop, and real physical media would give consumers confidence that the product will not be a waste of money in the future.

By not going the cartridge route they are ignoring a basic instinct to hoard and collect. People have been doing that since the stone age days. Collecting. And collecting will help sell titles are not necessarily the best. To complete a library, you know?

 

When you exchange money for goods, you are getting something. You are filling your personal space with something to be proud of. Something to display. NFT and online stores eschew all of that.

 

Quote

I also don't think they can afford to make the NFT part work for their previously released "physical media."  They should also ditch the touchscreens in the controllers and just add a few buttons in that area. It won't make the controller too complicated if they only add two or three.  These can be for secondary functions.  While that will mean that some of the games they planned will not work, like the card games, that's fine.

Just go with the something like the original Intellivision controllers, modernized and made reliable. Maybe even less painful. Do something about that spray-printed mylar circuit the original discs used. Use real buttons instead of some funky "touch" stuff, no cheap flex-circuitry.

 

The money saved by forgoing the NFT and online shit would make that possible.

 

Quote

They should also ditch the motion controls.  The Wii ship has already sailed!  Only one pack in game should be included (probably Shark! Shark!).  The system could launch with the following physical cartridges at $20 each:

 

1. Astrosmash

2. Biplanes

3. Breakout

4. Cloudy Mountain

5. Dynablaster

6. Evel Knievel

7. Finnigan Fox

8. Missile Command

9. Moon Patrol

10. Night Stalker

11. Rigid Force Redux

12. Shark! Shark!

13. Skiing

14. Snafoo

15. Tank Battle

I would get those. And make a nice collection from it. And enjoy the hunt if they released them a little at a time. Taking the time inbetween releases to polish up the games and make them the best they can be.

 

That was a hidden magic formula used in the old days. A console came out, maybe had 5 or so zero-day titles (to use a modern cliche'), and we LOVED looking forward to the next and the next. We liked this slower pace of things. Not everything has to happen faster-than-instant. Slow gave us time to get into a game and explore the tricks and achieve hi-scores.

 

Today it's just shovel the shit out there. And then fail the console, discontinue it, mark it as non-viable, if a few titles don't sell well. Or if one release is a total bomb. It's not tenable. Not sustainable the way these newfangled indie consoles operate. And nothing memorable about them. They don't give us time to make them memorable.

 

Not like the first stuff from the 80's. Playing the game itself was just one aspect of what we call "the experience". Back then there was schoolyard recess and classroom (when the teacher wasn't looking) banter about the new cartridge coming out next month. All the tips and tricks published in magazines sold in grocery stores. The excitement of discovery of something new on the store shelves or via a TV-spot ad. Sorry. A webpage and youtube videos don't even come close to delivering any of that.

 

And NFT cryptoshit just wedges itself in as an annoyance. A splotch on a good experience. And companies just continue ramrod it in your face.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Keatah

[Steven Pendleton]

42 minutes ago, Keatah said:

Not like the first stuff from the 80's. Playing the game itself was just one aspect of what we call "the experience". Back then there was schoolyard recess and classroom (when the teacher wasn't looking) banter about the new cartridge coming out next month. All the tips and tricks published in magazines sold in grocery stores. The excitement of discovery of something new on the store shelves or via a TV-spot ad. Sorry. A webpage and youtube videos don't even come close to delivering any of that.

One of the advantages of living in a foreign country without a phone with internet capabilities is that I still get to experience this. Go to an old game store (not new games, I know about most of those) and find a ton of PC Engine and Saturn games and it's like what the hell are these games? I don't know and it's fun. Can't read like a third of the titles and there's no way to research them without going home, so there's nothing but the box art and the screenshots and the description on the back of the box (which I usually can read, unlike the titles) to sell me on the game... except there's usually nothing but a barcode on the back of PC Engine HuCARD games anyway. That's why I don't buy a lot of HuCARD games, as I might waste my money on some junk. Good times.

 

Saturn, Mega Drive, Dreamcast, PC Engine CD, and PS1/PS2 are all easy to buy for, but Japanese Intellivision... lol there are no descriptions on the backs of Japanese Intellivision boxes, just 2 tiny little screenshots. Unfortunately I always forget what Intellivision games I have, especially since about half of them are duplicates that I got in a lot with my Intellivision, so I rarely buy Intellivision games.

[youxia]

59 minutes ago, Keatah said:

By not going the cartridge route they are ignoring a basic instinct to hoard and collect. People have been doing that since the stone age days. Collecting. And collecting will help sell titles are not necessarily the best. To complete a library, you know?

 

When you exchange money for goods, you are getting something. You are filling your personal space with something to be proud of. Something to display.

Wait, what happened to ONLY EMULAAAAATION !!! ?

[Keatah]

18 minutes ago, youxia said:

Wait, what happened to ONLY EMULAAAAATION !!! ?

I don't think anything happened to it. I'm kinda just sayin' what it's going to take to get a new system off the ground. Speaking in terms that others will understand and appreciate.

 

Everyone claims it's hard to see value in a drive full of bits. Well as long as I see it inside my own head it's good enough for me.

 

I've long ago permanently transcended the physical realm into emulation. Emulation provides a number things a physical collection cannot do. The pros of emulation continue to fit my needs & goals better than a wall of carts. Emulation is my own way of carrying the fun times of yore into the future. Further than a real physical collection could go. All the while maintaining fidelity and no degradation. Some may agree. Some may not. And that is ok.

 

So nothing really changed. A little devil's advocate is fun!

Edited March 29, 2022 by Keatah

[Flojomojo]

I'm surprised this topic is getting as much attention as it is ... the project is clearly floundering, and the concept was goofy from the start. It's like the Mike Kennedy projects except with more money. 

 

[+5-11under]

Coleco Chameleon: had a shell, and a bench with some equipment. Completion estimate opinion (could be wrong, but not likely): 0 to 2%. "Hopes and Dreams"^TM: infinite.

 

Intellivision Amico: that "more money" did get them a lot further, as far as hardware and software goes. Completion estimate guess/opinion (could easily be wrong) : 10 to 50%.

 

We could add the Atari (new) VCS: nothing revolutionary in my opinion, but hey, they got the job done.