Is the Amico dead?

[flynnz]

5 hours ago, mr_me said:

They had it all working last year.  They started taking it to the public in April 2021.  When you see it and when it's working aren't necessarily the same thing.

This is news to me and I was talking about 'well over a year ago' not "last year" But even still, you're telling me they had all of this "( Can boot to frontend, download/install games, can manage those games, manage game saves, general device options/settings and of course, play the games)." working last year, and never showed it? My understanding was they basically were just running the games at those events without showing ANY of the other core OS features needed for launch. I find it hard to believe they had/have any of those core elements working without showing them off like crazy... After all, this is a company that tried to hype up a box and PSU with a logo on it.

If I am missing something, please feel free to provide a video that shows off all those core features running on the Amico a year+ ago (outside of just running an APK raw). 

Edited April 2, 2022 by flynnz

[Razzie.P]

51 minutes ago, Pink said:

There is an ignore the topic button as well which is super simple to use.

That's the thing that's always seemed strange to me, too.  Instead of simply clicking "ignore," or even just ignoring things the old fashioned way by, you know... just ignoring it, users would rather take time to make posts (ironically contributing to the discussion) and complain to mods and site owners.   

 

 

37 minutes ago, flynnz said:

( Can boot to frontend, download/install games, can manage those games, manage game saves, general device options/settings and of course, play the games)." 

By "all working," they clearly meant "all except that stuff"  ?

[Razzie.P]

7 hours ago, mr_me said:

It doesn't matter how successful the Switch is, it doesn't mean a competitor can't find a place in the market nor does it mean they shouldn't try.

 

 

Absolutely!  Since the thing was announced, the "Switch exists, why should this" mentality has always been there, it seems, and that has never made sense to me.  We live in a world where numerous brands/companies can offer very similar products and find success, so it seemed strange that so many people wanna draw the line at video game hardware.   

 

But it was always funny, though, to find that those same people applied similar logic to the Switch early on, declaring "RIP Nintendo" and explaining how they should just make their games for PS and Xbox.  ?

[Cebus Capucinis]

I think the only reason people were so big on making the comparisons between Amico and Switch is because certain leadership at IE (cough cough) immediately screeched from the rooftops that it "DiDn'T cOmPeTe WiTh ThE sWiTcH" and that their market had "ZeRo OveRlAp" and was targeted entirely differently so any comparisons were just, well, you know the dead horse.... "Haters."

 

That got picked up in the old Amico threads by a few of the more persistent supporters, who repeatedly claimed that consumers wouldn't even see the two as comparable (despite the clear similarities. I distinctly recall a back-and-forth where users were literally saying "so what you're trying to say is if I'm in a store and Switch and Amico are next to each other, there won't be any debate?"), pointing out some invisible "market research" that was done or "focus groups" that indicated what they were claiming. Of course, this marketing info, just like the REST of their marketing data, is unavailable for review, but nonetheless, based on what we've been told about their marketing (namely the "there's 3 billion casual gamers so our market is clearly gigantic" and "families aren't interested in the Switch" lines) it seems any marketing they did have was based on unfounded premises at best and outright pork pies at worst.

[Steven Pendleton]

Market research is out there and very easy to find. I did. It took like 8 seconds. I don't want to pay several thousand dollars to read it, however, but nothing is stopping anyone else from doing so... aside from maybe not having several thousand dollars to spare just to read a thing.

Edited April 3, 2022 by Steven Pendleton

[mr_me]

3 hours ago, flynnz said:

This is news to me and I was talking about 'well over a year ago' not "last year" But even still, you're telling me they had all of this "( Can boot to frontend, download/install games, can manage those games, manage game saves, general device options/settings and of course, play the games)." working last year, and never showed it? My understanding was they basically were just running the games at those events without showing ANY of the other core OS features needed for launch. I find it hard to believe they had/have any of those core elements working without showing them off like crazy... After all, this is a company that tried to hype up a box and PSU with a logo on it.

If I am missing something, please feel free to provide a video that shows off all those core features running on the Amico a year+ ago (outside of just running an APK raw). 

All the consoles they took to those events booted to an interface where you select the game, some booted to the developer UI, some the user UI.  There's a video on the company youtube page from January 2021 showing booting to the user UI.  In around June last year the CEO took an Amico to the home of youtuber Artofmana.  His recounting included the system prompting to update firmware after booting up which they did through his home wifi.  Can't tell you how long the online game store for downloading games has been working.

 

Showing this stuff never seemed all that significant to me. They can't sell a system that doesn't boot or have a way to downloaded and select games.  It's the games that I wanted to see.

Edited April 3, 2022 by mr_me

[MrBeefy]

5 hours ago, flynnz said:

This is news to me and I was talking about 'well over a year ago' not "last year" But even still, you're telling me they had all of this "( Can boot to frontend, download/install games, can manage those games, manage game saves, general device options/settings and of course, play the games)." working last year, and never showed it? My understanding was they basically were just running the games at those events without showing ANY of the other core OS features needed for launch. I find it hard to believe they had/have any of those core elements working without showing them off like crazy... After all, this is a company that tried to hype up a box and PSU with a logo on it.

If I am missing something, please feel free to provide a video that shows off all those core features running on the Amico a year+ ago (outside of just running an APK raw). 

You aren't missing anything. All of the consoles shown off at events were not production ready models. Despite showing a prototype everything necessary for a launch was not ready. That has been established by both Fundable and the SEC docs.

 

Truth of the matter is they used different models to showcase different games. That's because the software wasn't ready and not every prototype could play every game properly.

 

Fundable had both the OS, and pack in games at less than 100%. It hasn't been "working" in the sense it isn't ready to manufacture. I could take their apk and upload it to my pi through an SD card but that doesn't mean it is ready to manufacture and everything is finished. ?

[MrBeefy]

5 hours ago, Razzie.P said:

That's the thing that's always seemed strange to me, too.  Instead of simply clicking "ignore," or even just ignoring things the old fashioned way by, you know... just ignoring it, users would rather take time to make posts (ironically contributing to the discussion) and complain to mods and site owners.   

 

 

By "all working," they clearly meant "all except that stuff"  ?

It is pretty easy to ignore stuff. I put a former CEO on ignore. It did wonders for making threads more readable and cut out the puffery. If anyone needs help on figuring out how to ignore people/topics I will be more than happy to help.

[SegaSnatcher]

7 hours ago, Razzie.P said:

Absolutely!  Since the thing was announced, the "Switch exists, why should this" mentality has always been there, it seems, and that has never made sense to me.  We live in a world where numerous brands/companies can offer very similar products and find success, so it seemed strange that so many people wanna draw the line at video game hardware.   

 

But it was always funny, though, to find that those same people applied similar logic to the Switch early on, declaring "RIP Nintendo" and explaining how they should just make their games for PS and Xbox.  ?

Yes, I'm all for more consoles being released, but the games need to justify why said console needs to exist in the first place and why people should invest in said console. The console also needs to be priced appropriately for the types of gaming experiences as well. So many factors to take into consideration. The only thing we know for sure is that around 6 - 10K people were interested enough in the Amico to make a preorder.  Given the target market IE was hoping to appeal to those numbers are extremely poor. 

 

[roots.genoa]

5 hours ago, Cebus Capucinis said:

I think the only reason people were so big on making the comparisons between Amico and Switch is because certain leadership at IE (cough cough) immediately screeched from the rooftops that it "DiDn'T cOmPeTe WiTh ThE sWiTcH" and that their market had "ZeRo OveRlAp" and was targeted entirely differently so any comparisons were just, well, you know the dead horse.... "Haters."

And maybe there would have also been less comparisons if that same "certain leadership at IE (cough cough)" didn't make outrageous claims like a Switch plus a game and controller costing as much as a house or the eShop being filled with child porn games and torture simulators. ?

(I'm of course exaggerating even more for comedic purpose)

[youxia]

8 hours ago, Razzie.P said:

Absolutely!  Since the thing was announced, the "Switch exists, why should this" mentality has always been there, it seems, and that has never made sense to me.  We live in a world where numerous brands/companies can offer very similar products and find success,

The problem here is that it's the price being similar, but not the quality. Switch and Amico are nowhere near each other when it comes to that crucial factor, regarding both games and hardware. Therefore it's not as much "Switch exists, why should this" but "Switch/Xbox S cost that much, how on Earth can Amico too?".

 

Like I've said many time before, if they managed to price this thing somewhere below 150USD, then it would all start making sense. It's the zone where people do impulse buys, and everyone loves new gadgets so even Amico could get some traction.

 

 

[Ignorama]

TBH, I really missed all the drama around Amico, never bothered to follow any news. I was stunned when I heard about the project, but not in a positive way. I have a full 125 set and several other stuff, I bought two Grips Arcade sticks (still best piece of hardware) and invested in an RGB Mod last year. So I consider myself a fan of the Intellivision, not on cmart level, but above average level. That said, I am no dreamer and it was crystal clear for me, that the brand Intellivision is not appealing for the audience of gamers. When I heard about the price of above 200$ I thought they were kidding. A very, very, VERY overpriced console, that offers games that barely reach Smart Phone potential, by using a brand most people never even heard off. For me it was dead before the start, but people told me that guys like Tallarico know what they are doing, so I went in a deep slumber and just ignored all of the Amico, cause I certainly knew it was not for me, even if I consider myself a above average fan of the OG Intellivision.

 

That said, not even I expected this level of failure. I thought they release it, it flops as expected and will be a rare obscurity in the gaming history. Sad for everybody who invested money, I hope they refund one day. But the project itself had no chance at any point. If gaming is Game of Thrones, Amico was always a follower of the drowned God on the Iron Isles, competely embracing the "what is dead may never die" motto.

Edited April 3, 2022 by Ignorama

[mr_me]

3 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said:

Yes, I'm all for more consoles being released, but the games need to justify why said console needs to exist in the first place and why people should invest in said console. The console also needs to be priced appropriately for the types of gaming experiences as well. So many factors to take into consideration. The only thing we know for sure is that around 6 - 10K people were interested enough in the Amico to make a preorder.  Given the target market IE was hoping to appeal to those numbers are extremely poor. 

 

They introduced the Amico on a retro video game forum and at a retro video game expo, and it has been discussed ever since by retro video game youtubers.  A system that doesn't even play retro video games.  In 2021 they presented at E3 publicly; what audience watches E3 presentations?  There is some crossover but these things aren't reaching either of their two primary target markets. And unlike other products, they've been telling people to wait until they play the system before purchasing; that they intended to take the system on mall tours around launch; that you don't need to preorder, there will be plenty available at launch.  Things have changed but that was the original plan.

 

You didn't mention the success they had with retailers going back to 2019, around 100k units.  They are a key part to reaching their target market.

 

2 hours ago, youxia said:

The problem here is that it's the price being similar, but not the quality. Switch and Amico are nowhere near each other when it comes to that crucial factor, regarding both games and hardware. Therefore it's not as much "Switch exists, why should this" but "Switch/Xbox S cost that much, how on Earth can Amico too?".

 

Like I've said many time before, if they managed to price this thing somewhere below 150USD, then it would all start making sense. It's the zone where people do impulse buys, and everyone loves new gadgets so even Amico could get some traction.

 

 

You can price a Playstation5 at $99 and there will be people that won't buy it, while they might happily pay over $200 for s RetroVGS or even one board game.  And of course other people will pay over $500 for a PS5.  Is one wrong.  The $250 for the package with controllers and games is still affordable.  Impulse buying isn't the answer,  what matters is if they are offering the experiences that people want.

[SegaSnatcher]

39 minutes ago, mr_me said:

You didn't mention the success they had with retailers going back to 2019, around 100k units.  They are a key part to reaching their target market

Sure, we can agree they are a key part of reaching to the target market.   Though, until they actually manufacture those 100K units we can't talk about any success.  

[youxia]

52 minutes ago, mr_me said:

You can price a Playstation5 at $99 and there will be people that won't buy it, while they might happily pay over $200 for s RetroVGS or even one board game.

Sorry, but these are absurd arguments. Perhaps it's time to take a break from trying to rebuke every single thing posted by multiple people?

 

Things like RetroVGS or very expensive board games are specialized items aimed at a very specific audience, not billions of casuals, this is why they can command higher prices. They also don't compete with much superior products in the same price range. And you can try to show me a person who'd rather spend +250USD on Amico than a 100 on PS5, but I think we'd wait quite a long time for that.  

 

 

[atarifan88]

On 4/1/2022 at 7:44 PM, MrBeefy said:

Intellivision didn't even tell the retailer Game Stop it wasn't coming out yesterday, and I think they've reached their target audience.

 

Besides they can't even make the Founder Editions. Does anyone think they can actually produce enough units to get into retail? Does anyone think they have money to market it? Even if it launches it is a dead end from there. Does anyone really believe people are going to buy this at $300 to $350?

I believe the listing on Gamestop had the Amico at $250-300 depending on which one you wanted. The purple one came with a $50 game card, so that was the more expensive one.  I agree, even at $250 it's a lot of money.  When I was looking at the base price for a Switch and saw it at $300 I thought that was a lot of money too.  Obviously they have no problems with that price point.

 

EDIT: I just saw your posts after this one.  Wow, IE was going to change the price of the Amico to $350!  Compared to the Switch, even I would opt for the Switch at that point! ?

Edited April 3, 2022 by atarifan88

[atarifan88]

On 4/1/2022 at 9:44 PM, Rev said:

The Switch mini is only 200.00 usd. A great deal!  We have 3 Switches. The library, both physical and digital are fantastic. Even with lots of retro compilations. Two volumes of Atari classics as well. 

Two volumes?  I only see one... Atari Flashback Classics.  Which is the other one?

[atarifan88]

On 4/2/2022 at 5:48 AM, MrBeefy said:

It makes zero sense for a family to buy an Amico over a Switch at the price without the nostalgia being the main draw. The software they have shown isn't special or stand out enough at the same price as the Switch to make a dent in that market. Switch eshop has a bunch of similar games and will usually be as cheap or cheaper than Amico games.

 

Take the name Intellivision out of it and it would be interesting to see how many of those 6000 would have preordered.

Good points for sure.  After searching the Switch library of games, they have plenty of retro to get the nostalgia vibe going!  Looks like I'm sold on it.  Funny that I had to come to the Intellivision form to be sold on a Switch! ?

[MrBeefy]

 

1 hour ago, atarifan88 said:

Good points for sure.  After searching the Switch library of games, they have plenty of retro to get the nostalgia vibe going!  Looks like I'm sold on it.  Funny that I had to come to the Intellivision form to be sold on a Switch! ?

Following Amico is how we ended up getting a Switch so it makes sense. You can get the retro fix, new AAA fix, or simple game fix. She didn't like the Amico price and didn't like the games shown. She was sold on Animal Crossing and Clubhouse games. She plays a bunch of board games or puzzle games like Dr. Mario.

 

2 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said:

Sure, we can agree they are a key part of reaching to the target market.   Though, until they actually manufacture those 100K units we can't talk about any success.  

If anyone watched closely on this saga you will notice the "casual mom market" was tagged on later. From initial presentations to the games it was always intended to be a retro bait console. It is even including the jzintv emulator.

 

My guess is someone at Intellivision got greedy and wanted to make it this is for 3 billion people. This is a way to try and make the console sound more relevant and rope in investors. So they shifted talk but not really the product. They based the controls around retro, included a retro game emulator on it, spent too much time talking to retro YouTubers. Spent marketing money to make posters at Game Stop (where they listed it under retro ), spent marketing money on E3 for gamers. They did one Mom 2.0 event. Yet they have spent way more time on retro gamers. There is a disconnect between what they say and what they've done. 

 

The marketing has always started. If people want to actually stop and think about it every video game console is for the family. There is a reason people don't buy video games and it isn't due to lack of options. It is due to it isn't a hobby they really care about, and that's okay. Before someone mentions the strawman about not wanting more options in the market, no one has said that. What they've said is where does it exist. It does less than other consoles but is priced the same or possibly higher.

 

For those acting like they can't play games with their families I feel really sorry for them. They are probably struggling more with adjusting their likes to match what their family likes. In fact as I'm typing this TLDR post Jr Beef and I set up a game on the Switch and are going to play together. This Momolu and Friends is a darn cute game but not one I would choose myself. But he likes it and we get to spend time together playing it. I don't need Astrosmash 2023 to do it if it is something I truly want to do with my family.

 

Edited April 3, 2022 by MrBeefy
Intellevision Peak mistake

[IMBerzerk]

Animal Crossing is one of the best selling "kids" non-combat orientated titles next to Minecraft.  Best game for little hands and minds.  

 

IE completely failed because instead of going the IP route with multiple stuff, simple marketing tactics and all...they hooked in investors with bigger than life ideas and a guy that yes'd every single idea to death.  Like a car salesman does.  Yet they produced nothing other than overpriced t-shirts and some other useless apparel.  

 

What they should have done can be debated for the rest of eternity... but at this point, it's moot.  They failed in a way that many big idea companies do and used every excuse in the book to hide it.  Chips, supply, family issues...whatever. 

 

I haven't been very negative up to this point, but one has to come to reality that this was nothing more than a big idea, promoted by a guy with a bigger mouth.  

 

It's now April... End of 1st Q 2022...where the hell is the console?

[Cebus Capucinis]

For all my negativity, we are still here and we *are* still talking about it, so that's something. While I think their chances of actually releasing and selling a complete console conjure up images of snowballs and demons, even I can't say the chance is 0.

 

Even if in just a minor way with their shakeup of leadership, they've shown they're at least slightly willing to see the cracks in the wall (vs. the previous attitude, which to me was simply "plug ears, shake head, scream 'HATER'"). Their idea needs massive retooling and a huge business focus pivot, IMO, but they may be starting to see that, and maybe, just maybe, they'll crank out 6,000-10,000 or so retooled retro consoles or something closer to what the market seems to bear.

 

Again, I still see snowballs and demons, especially given the track record, but fat ladies also aren't singing just yet....

[mr_me]

4 hours ago, SegaSnatcher said:

Sure, we can agree they are a key part of reaching to the target market.   Though, until they actually manufacture those 100K units we can't talk about any success.  

And those POs might no longer be valid, even preorders can be cancelled, but the retailers did see potential of the system in that range of numbers and that was the achievement.

 

3 hours ago, youxia said:

Sorry, but these are absurd arguments. Perhaps it's time to take a break from trying to rebuke every single thing posted by multiple people?

 

Things like RetroVGS or very expensive board games are specialized items aimed at a very specific audience, not billions of casuals, this is why they can command higher prices. They also don't compete with much superior products in the same price range. And you can try to show me a person who'd rather spend +250USD on Amico than a 100 on PS5, but I think we'd wait quite a long time for that.  

 

 

It shows that technical superiority and price are not the primary factors for people finding value in a product.  Techically a Playstation5 has enormous value for 3D graphics processing, doesn't mean I have any use for it.  I understand that Amico has to deliver on the experience to create value and people have their opinion, but I wouldn't presume how anybody should place value on different products. I think Amico competes with all types of  games not just video games.

 

1 hour ago, MrBeefy said:

If anyone watched closely on this saga you will notice the "casual mom market" was tagged on later. From initial presentations to the games it was always intended to be a retro bait console. It is even including the jzintv emulator.

I thought it was a retro console too, until it's reveal in October 2018.  "We are creating a console that parents WANT to buy", "I think it’s about time somebody focused on families with kid-friendly games", "Our goal was to create a console that both gamers and non-gamers are able to have fun with and play together", “Intellivision’s policy to only offer games rated E for Everyone and E10+ for Everyone 10 and up on its new system makes finding the right games easier for busy families, especially those with young gamers.”  No mention of emulated retro games in the press release or reveal video, it came up only when asked.  It's pretty clear their family focus, inclusive gaming vision has been there from the beginning.

 

No the Amico does not come with any retro game emulators.  It can run them like any other system when they decide to make some available.

[MrBeefy]

3 hours ago, IMBerzerk said:

Animal Crossing is one of the best selling "kids" non-combat orientated titles next to Minecraft.  Best game for little hands and minds.  

 

IE completely failed because instead of going the IP route with multiple stuff, simple marketing tactics and all...they hooked in investors with bigger than life ideas and a guy that yes'd every single idea to death.  Like a car salesman does.  Yet they produced nothing other than overpriced t-shirts and some other useless apparel.  

 

What they should have done can be debated for the rest of eternity... but at this point, it's moot.  They failed in a way that many big idea companies do and used every excuse in the book to hide it.  Chips, supply, family issues...whatever. 

 

I haven't been very negative up to this point, but one has to come to reality that this was nothing more than a big idea, promoted by a guy with a bigger mouth.  

 

It's now April... End of 1st Q 2022...where the hell is the console?

It's the Homer Car of consoles.

3 hours ago, Cebus Capucinis said:

For all my negativity, we are still here and we *are* still talking about it, so that's something. While I think their chances of actually releasing and selling a complete console conjure up images of snowballs and demons, even I can't say the chance is 0.

Oh I think it will still come out and them die a quick death in 6 months to a year with servers being shut down. I don't think they will be able to get past the first batch of production. That being said I will also not be surprised if they get zero consoles shipped 

2 hours ago, mr_me said:

 

No the Amico does not come with any retro game emulators. 

You are trying to say that the jzintv emulator is not a retro emulator? Because it is baked into the system and last time I checked it was for original Intv games which 40 odd years later are retro. ?

[Cebus Capucinis]

It plays retro games? What other major console on the market plays games from the 80s? I'd guess the Switch, but they don't compete with Amico.....

 

I mean they did the Crayola thing and a couple other events, and they were planning on some decent kid oriented titles. If they went fully that route I could see a niche that actually isn't filled by a console. The downside there though is they're competing with every tablet and phone out there....

 

I do wonder if there's a niche in the cheaper side kid friendly consoles. Sort of like a better V-Tech or V-Smile type thing. Of course, at $350 it ain't gonna move units, but if they got in a nice little kid oriented console for $100ish, there might be something there.

[Rev]

6 hours ago, atarifan88 said:

Two volumes?  I only see one... Atari Flashback Classics.  Which is the other one?

I was thinking of the PS4 version, which has 2 volumes.  Switch has one, sorry about that. ? 

 

Check out Burgertime Party too.  Its ok. 
 

 

 

This has a Bomberman type game on it.   You can also get Bomberman. 

 

And Namco.

 

Edited April 3, 2022 by Rev