Jaguar+, Yay or Nay?

[agradeneu]

4 hours ago, alucardX said:

Gaming is in a good place where the power of a console only means so much. Switch is proof of that. Combine that with an interest in modern retro and I think Jaguar+ with new games (Jumping at Shadows for example) really could be profitable and worth Atari's time and create a new avenue for devs to make money.

Switch is a modern console, Jaguar is like a stone age Relict compared to it.

 

Thanks for your Enthusiasm towards JAS, but realistically, it would be just another Indie on modern Platforms, let alone a System seller.

[alucardX]

7 hours ago, agradeneu said:

Switch is a modern console, Jaguar is like a stone age Relict compared to it.

 

Thanks for your Enthusiasm towards JAS, but realistically, it would be just another Indie on modern Platforms, let alone a System seller.

Switch is modernish. The point is that the games are what make the system great, not the other way around. There are plenty of people buying modern retro style games on GOG and [nasty]steam. There is a lot of interest in playing games that have a simple premise, are fun to play and look like older games did. Nintendo often delivers on that in some ways and people enjoy that. Because they deliver on that they sell hardware that is almost a decade old (and make money on their hardware) and can sell their games, no matter the age, at full price.

 

This is a great time for Atari and a Jaguar compatible may not be a massive market hit in a billion dollar industry but it could make money for Atari, give indie devs somewhere new to share their games (for profit, to cover costs or gratis) and revive interest in the Jaguar. Even a fraction of money in a billion dollar industry can be profit.

 

JAS genuinely looks and plays amazing and there is no reason why it couldn't find a large audience. If you look at the market right now there are people just sitting in little private corners of gaming niches. Atari is carving a gaming niche and there is a place and demand for it. Jaguar should be a part of the niche.

[Clint Thompson]

1 hour ago, alucardX said:

Jaguar should be a part of the niche.

The Jaguar has been niche for going on the 30-years now. Outside of Hasbro’s Atari having released the rights to make it a completely free platform to develop for, it hasn’t needed a single thing from Atari to be what it has become today. Games like JAS is a great example of what makes the Jaguar so special. 

 

So far, I see current Atari re-attaining rights to the platform and nothing more. Doubtfully coincidental and since both have remained radio silent on the exact reason, I conclude seeing Songbird no longer using Jaguar or Lynx logos as a result. Atari obviously sees some form of money being there.
 

Given the time it has taken for the Jaguar to go from a completely failed platform to platform rights released publicly shortly after to now some 20+ years later, where the community devs have finally gotten enough tools and experience to make it feasible for far easier and interesting developments to take place, consoles selling for $400 on average and new games ranging from $79-$129… I’d say it’s rather convenient timing to come back and reclaim the cat for some of that sweet, sweet cash.

 

I could say pardon my inner pessimist but given that no one is talking about the protruding obvious red flags (from either side), I’ll be holding my breath on this one. 

 

I would however, love to be wrong.

[roots.genoa]

Edit: never mind.

Edited October 9, 2023 by roots.genoa

[Dan Iacovelli]

first they have to find a good emulator for jaguar so far the only good I hear is BigPEmu  which is constantly being worked on.
then we will see how it goes.

[Gunther]

Wade Rosen gives the Jag community a heads-up in the ATARI 50 section of this video:

 

 

Edited October 10, 2023 by Gunther

[UHATEIT]

On 9/25/2023 at 11:52 AM, zzip said:

What if they just made a Jaguar controller for the VCS and ran BigPemu on that?

That's what I've been doing with my VCS800. Have a USB dongle to boot into PC Mode, and have BigPEmu on the VCS, bought this thing here called a Jag Dapter that let's you plug the Jag controller into it and connects to the VCS with a printer cable. Fairly simple, but let's me use the actual Jaguar controller to play Jag on the VCS in HD

Edited October 10, 2023 by UHATEIT

[+GoldLeader]

NO.

 

I'd rather they do it Right.

 

 

 

In other words a system that plays Jaguar games,  not Some games....ALL games.  (Not Emulated).   Also if they call it a Jaguar,  they are retarded.

[Clint Thompson]

7 hours ago, GoldLeader said:

Also if they call it a Jaguar,  they are retarded.

What else would they call it?

[UHATEIT]

4 minutes ago, Clint Thompson said:

What else would they call it?

"CatBox" but thats already taken. However since no one outside of the Jag community has ever heard of the catbox it would probably be alright 

[zzip]

27 minutes ago, UHATEIT said:

"CatBox" but thats already taken. However since no one outside of the Jag community has ever heard of the catbox it would probably be alright 

Catbox sounds too much like "litter box" to me

 

[jerseystyle]

22 hours ago, alucardX said:

Switch is modernish. The point is that the games are what make the system great, not the other way around. There are plenty of people buying modern retro style games on GOG and [nasty]steam. There is a lot of interest in playing games that have a simple premise, are fun to play and look like older games did. Nintendo often delivers on that in some ways and people enjoy that. Because they deliver on that they sell hardware that is almost a decade old (and make money on their hardware) and can sell their games, no matter the age, at full price.

 

This is a great time for Atari and a Jaguar compatible may not be a massive market hit in a billion dollar industry but it could make money for Atari, give indie devs somewhere new to share their games (for profit, to cover costs or gratis) and revive interest in the Jaguar. Even a fraction of money in a billion dollar industry can be profit.

 

JAS genuinely looks and plays amazing and there is no reason why it couldn't find a large audience. If you look at the market right now there are people just sitting in little private corners of gaming niches. Atari is carving a gaming niche and there is a place and demand for it. Jaguar should be a part of the niche.

But they already did this with the VCS. That’s the niche. We know what the demand is because it’s been done. Doing a niche of a niche (when the first niche has lost money for them) is nuts. Remember, as we learned with the CC and the Amico, just because YOU really want something doesn’t mean it’ll be a viable product.

[Clint Thompson]

19 minutes ago, jerseystyle said:

But they already did this with the VCS. That’s the niche. We know what the demand is because it’s been done. Doing a niche of a niche (when the first niche has lost money for them) is nuts. Remember, as we learned with the CC and the Amico, just because YOU really want something doesn’t mean it’ll be a viable product.

Wasn’t the Kickstarter funded like $3 million on top of whatever other sales they managed to push through? I’m guessing the loss is more to do with the legal issues they ran into and not launching the VCS, seeing as it’s a relatively simple low-end box. But a loss is a loss. Sounds like they’ve sold less VCS units than the JagCD and that was 25k. 

 

On one hand, at best they might sell 1,500 - 2,500 Jaguar mini units for example, optimistically speaking. It could probably garner close to a quarter million profit (potentially) and anything extra would be a bonus. Then again, they might sell 200 units and end up even worse off than the VCS. All price dependent of course but if there’s one fuming variable to take into consideration it’s that collectors and purists will always prefer original hardware over any new recycled reincarnation they might come up with. 

Edited October 10, 2023 by Clint Thompson

[alucardX]

I don't think the VCS is a good comparison. Let's look at how the 2600+ does. The VCS is really cool and has some neat ideas but at the end of the day it is not offering me much that I can't get some place else. I can buy a used PS4 and scratch most of the itches that the VCS does.

 

The difference here is that the Jaguar+ unit could probably be produced for a lot less money and would be enhancing a niche that has room to grow. As many have said, we're tired of paying so much for consoles and original games. Also, just like other classics the Jaguar+ benefit would be a clean, nice picture to the TV without any hassle. There is a lot that can be done for original Jag fans and new fans as well.

 

Also I do agree with @Clint Thompson that purists will prefer the original hardware but that is only going to be good for so long and not all of us were lucky enough to build a big collection before the prices went through the roof. I would much rather support Atari in innovating in retro than Nintendo in innovating in iteration and re-releases. Or for that matter Sony in making over the shoulder simulation story things or Microsoft in buying up the competition. Atari has the chance to do some interesting things in an area we really care about.

[+Stephen]

56 minutes ago, Clint Thompson said:

On one hand, at best they might sell 1,500 - 2,500 Jaguar mini units for example, optimistically speaking.

But, if they use the same model as the 2600 and the annual re-re-releases, 20 years from now, they could be selling the 20th revision of it.  BAM - there's the large sales numbers!

[jerseystyle]

33 minutes ago, alucardX said:

I don't think the VCS is a good comparison. Let's look at how the 2600+ does. The VCS is really cool and has some neat ideas but at the end of the day it is not offering me much that I can't get some place else. I can buy a used PS4 and scratch most of the itches that the VCS does.

 

The difference here is that the Jaguar+ unit could probably be produced for a lot less money and would be enhancing a niche that has room to grow. As many have said, we're tired of paying so much for consoles and original games. Also, just like other classics the Jaguar+ benefit would be a clean, nice picture to the TV without any hassle. There is a lot that can be done for original Jag fans and new fans as well.

 

Also I do agree with @Clint Thompson that purists will prefer the original hardware but that is only going to be good for so long and not all of us were lucky enough to build a big collection before the prices went through the roof. I would much rather support Atari in innovating in retro than Nintendo in innovating in iteration and re-releases. Or for that matter Sony in making over the shoulder simulation story things or Microsoft in buying up the competition. Atari has the chance to do some interesting things in an area we really care about.

But you can’t compare the 2600+ to the Jaguar. One sold millions of units back in the day, still has nostalgia cred, etc… the other doesn’t. And what games could Atari re-release for it that would sell? T2K and then what? I don’t think they have access to much else.

[alucardX]

10 minutes ago, jerseystyle said:

But you can’t compare the 2600+ to the Jaguar. One sold millions of units back in the day, still has nostalgia cred, etc… the other doesn’t. And what games could Atari re-release for it that would sell? T2K and then what? I don’t think they have access to much else.

They have a number of ways they can approach this including their newer titles. A Jag version of Mr. Run and Jump could be quite good and worth playing, for example. They could probably do some really cool things with the recharged games on Jag. it would be really great if Atari were able to pay some of the community devs to work on games too, for those willing or interested of course.

[+GoldLeader]

To clarify my thoughts,  if they did a hardware level recreation of the Jaguar or perhaps better yet an FPGA Jaguar that would be Awesome!,  but if they put out a half-assed emulator that didn't play all the games and had spotty performance (a "Jaguar +") it would suck.

 

OTOH,  If you're not gonna do it that way,  It might still work if Only as a Plug + Play. And in my mind Only if they follow the Nintendo Classic model.  That is to say,  (let's assume they had the rights to some good games and had all that figured out for this theoretical model), if they only put out a "mini" with well configured games that looked and played virtually identical to their Jag counterparts,  it might be OK.

 

So,  while I'd be all for them doing it Right,  I don't think half-assing it is the way to go here.

 

Note:  The reason you don't simply call it "The Jaguar" is the same reason you shouldn't re-use a name like VCS (A VCS AKA 2600 Already exists) and a Jaguar already exists.  A Better name (off the top of my tired brain) in my opinion?  Jag Ultra, The Jag Mini, Mini Jag, JAGToo, SuperJaguar...

 

(Just something different than the same exact name)...

[alucardX]

24 minutes ago, GoldLeader said:

(Just something different than the same exact name)...

Jaguar 2000 🫣

[roots.genoa]

3 hours ago, GoldLeader said:

(Just something different than the same exact name)...

The Jaguar+? 🙂

[Gunther]

ATARI are looking for developers to make a new Bubsy game:

 

https://x.com/atari/status/1712101697604993453?s=20

 

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Gunther

[jerseystyle]

20 minutes ago, Gunther said:

ATARI are looking for developers to make a new Bubsy game:

 

https://x.com/atari/status/1712101697604993453?s=20

 

 

In the Endtimes there will be only Bubsy.

[alucardX]

1 hour ago, jerseystyle said:

In the Endtimes there will be only Bubsy.

He's a highlander?

[LordKraken]

ok ok i get the recharged serie, nice initiative, legendary games... but bubsy... seriously!?

[JagChris]

7 hours ago, LordKraken said:

ok ok i get the recharged serie, nice initiative, legendary games... but bubsy... seriously!?

Well yeah. It makes sense. Its the highest profile iP of that type they own isn't it? If they own something else now as well like Earthworm Jim they need to go with that but otherwise...