Crystal clear HDMI video output LumaCode

[Geister]

I believe it would have to emulate artifacting.  Without it, some old games might be a little colorless.

[invisible kid]

That's fine, artifacting isn't that popular, so it probably won't be added.

[+scorpio_ny]

7 minutes ago, invisible kid said:

That's fine, artifacting isn't that popular, so it probably won't be added.

I do not see why not. It is the external video scaler that does all the work, not the add on module. For instance, you can add scan lines. And it is being upgraded all the time.I will see if there are any options or support for it.

[+scorpio_ny]

7 hours ago, invisible kid said:

That's fine, artifacting isn't that popular, so it probably won't be added.

I just checked some of the documentation for the RGBHDMI project  and it does support artifacting with the ability to fine tune it. I will see if play around with it with some games that use artifacting to see how well it works. Here is the reference guide.

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by scorpio_ny

[invisible kid]

Wow! Pleasant surprise!

[+scorpio_ny]

HI @invisible kid,

 

I tried the artifacting options it it does not seem to do anything. I opened up ticket with the developer to see if there is something else I need to do or if it is a bug. I will report back once I get more info.

 

[invisible kid]

Fingers crossed!

[invisible kid]

Warming up to this, as I've avoided all video upgrades up till now, but I really like the idea/design behind this one.

 

I guess this wouldn't disable or modify the original video output din signals? Would the common way to install this be to have a HDMI connector on the 8bit? Either added or using an existing cutout? I am guessing no, because we would be also using RGBtoHDMI, and only need one for the different Ataris that have the mod. Does that use some kind of connector? Sorry couldn't suss it out.

 

Also haven't really dove into the Raspberry PI scene yet, may be a good opportunity.

 

Thanks for any answers, I might install this on an 800, 800XL, 130XE, and XEGS if doable.

Edited November 5, 2023 by invisible kid

[+scorpio_ny]

6 hours ago, invisible kid said:

I guess this wouldn't disable or modify the original video output din signals?

Nope! It does not disable the original video circuits. In fact, you can drive two displays at the same time if you wanted.

6 hours ago, invisible kid said:

Would the common way to install this be to have a HDMI connector on the 8bit? Either added or using an existing cutout? I am guessing no, because we would be also using RGBtoHDMI, and only need one for the different Ataris that have the mod. Does that use some kind of connector? Sorry couldn't suss it out.

This connects externally via two wires. The author of this mod suggests repurposing the connector in the RF module and he supplies cables and clips to do this. You will have to disconnect the original connections to the RF plug. Here is how it would look. This  mod then connects to the RGBtoHDMI upscaler powered with a Raspberry PI. From the upscaler is where you would connect your HDMI cable to. You will need and HDMI adapter or cable if use of the Rasberry Pi's that have the small HDMI connector.  You can figure out different ways to rout it outside too since it is just two wires. On my XE remake, I did not have and RF modulator, so I leveraged the holes for it with a 3D print and used RCA plugs for it and my Pokeymax:

  

 

 

6 hours ago, invisible kid said:

 

Also haven't really dove into the Raspberry PI scene yet, may be a good opportunity.

 

Thanks for any answers, I might install this on an 800, 800XL, 130XE, and XEGS if doable.

 

[Simius]

On 11/1/2023 at 5:18 AM, scorpio_ny said:

I would agree if only the Sophia chip was more readily available at a more reasonable cost. At last count, the Sophia chips were being sold for $150 each and are still unavailable.

These were been sold for $150 only because of global chip shortage and the need to purchase chips even several times more expensive outside the authorised distributor network. New batch will be cheaper. 

[invisible kid]

Awesome, thanks.

[+scorpio_ny]

3 hours ago, Simius said:

These were been sold for $150 only because of global chip shortage and the need to purchase chips even several times more expensive outside the authorised distributor network. New batch will be cheaper. 

Thank you @Simius for the update! 

[pseudografx]

7 hours ago, Simius said:

These were been sold for $150 only because of global chip shortage and the need to purchase chips even several times more expensive outside the authorised distributor network. New batch will be cheaper. 

Is there a timeframe for the new batch? 🙂

[+scorpio_ny]

Hi @invisible kid,

 

I have an update on the artifacting support ticket . The developer stated it is not supported/implemented in the RGBItoHDMI profile for the Atari. It seems he was not aware that some games leveraged this technique on the Atari. I listed a bunch of games and linked a technical article about artifacting on the Atari. Waiting on a reply. I will report back with new updates. 

[Simius]

On 11/6/2023 at 4:59 PM, pseudografx said:

Is there a timeframe for the new batch? 🙂

Should be before the end of year. 

[ScreamingAtTheRadio]

2c on this old discussion: I've installed both GTIA Digitizer (twice) and Sophia2 on some of my machines, and much prefer Sophia2. Sophia is pretty much plug and play, it just works, whereas GTIA Digitizer has hit or miss monitor compatibility and is quite finicky to setup. If you mess up the resolution to something your system won't support, you're screwed and have to reset the hardware, pretty much. Not to devalue the effort, it's a great idea on principle and I hear it works great on other systems, but for me the software on the Pi is just not there yet. Plus the fact that Sophia completely replaces the aging chip, and it's a no-brainer for me.

[pancio]

If you have VBXE/Sophia2 you may use cheap upscaller RGB2HDMI and use it with Audio stereo together on HDMI cable... Moreover, you don't need to damage Atari's enclosure and equip it with additional PCB like SAVO...  Results? Very good! Vertical bars on picture are from power distribution - need to add some capacitance near to GTIA/CPU.

 

 

 

[Beeblebrox]

4 hours ago, pancio said:

If you have VBXE/Sophia2 you may use cheap upscaller RGB2HDMI and use it with Audio stereo together on HDMI cable... Moreover, you don't need to damage Atari's enclosure and equip it with additional PCB like SAVO...  Results? Very good! Vertical bars on picture are from power distribution - need to add some capacitance near to GTIA/CPU.

 

 

 

 

I saw this over on Atarionline.pl earlier in the week. As an owner of both sophia 2 and the gtiadigitizer set ups, it appears like it has good results. I may try it sometime. Edit:I have a VBXE setup which I also might try it with. 

 

The cheap device in question which you mod is this:

For PS1/PS2 RGB/YPbPr to HDMI HDMI Adapter Video Cable HD Converter For PS1|PS2

 

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266145720543

Edited April 3 by Beeblebrox

[pancio]

Yes, I noticed users on https://atarionline.pl/forum/comments.php?DiscussionID=7481&page=1#Item_3 as well. Next week I'll try with other upscallers (cheper!).

 

BR,

pancio

 

Edited April 3 by pancio

[pancio]

 

Hi again,

 

Are you still locking for crystal clear video with audio stereo on HDMI? You will find them here... https://systemembedded.eu/viewtopic.php?t=58

Of course, this is just a concept that requires refining the housing and microHDMI connection. But you will admit that the possibilities are huge 🙂

Now I'm working with my colleagues to find a suitable housing that will fit in place of the TV modulator. You won't need to make any additional holes!

 

Update soon...

 

 

 

 

[+mytek]

1 hour ago, pancio said:

Are you still locking for crystal clear video with audio stereo on HDMI? You will find them here... https://systemembedded.eu/viewtopic.php?t=58

Not as good as LumaCode or Sophia because you are converting the analog video to HDMI, whereas the LumaCode digitizer is directly reading an interpreting the GTIA digital signals.

 

Unless I'm mistaken, all you've done is repackage an off-the-shelf S-Video to HDMI converter. So I doubt that the video will be crystal clear since it's reliant on the quality of the stock Atari analog video circuits.

 

I did something similar in this project (XEP80-II).

[pancio]

You're right... but the price-quality ratio and the advantages such as sound via HDMI and no need to destroy the housing convince me more... It's very good alternative in my opinion...

I tested it on stock 30 years old Atari, with modulator and without any extensions inside. VBXE has HDMI limitation, Sophia doesn't work properly with many TVs - proposed solution working without any issue via 5 meters long cable! 

It's not rocket science... just a simple idea that produces desired results with little effort..

 

Did you used AV signal or LUMA/CHROMA signals in XEP80-II?

 

BR,

pancio

 

[+mytek]

On 4/15/2024 at 12:56 PM, pancio said:

You're right... but the price-quality ratio and the advantages such as sound via HDMI and no need to destroy the housing convince me more... It's very good alternative in my opinion...

Yes I agree, and I have several of these much cheaper alternatives laying around my house just for this use. However I'm intrigued by the LumaCode product and will be investing in at least one to test it out. If it works well, then I'll buy a few more of the GTIAdizer part only at I believe $35 a pop and use the single decoder on a single HDTV. This should be pretty economical when used on multiple computers who share a common monitor.

 

LumaCode only requires an RCA jack to feed out the signal, so the unneeded RF modulator's jack is used for that (no additional holes).

 

On 4/15/2024 at 12:56 PM, pancio said:

Did you used AV signal or LUMA/CHROMA signals in XEP80-II?

I used Luma for the XEP80 output, and then gave the user the choice of either Composite or S-Video (Luma/Chroma) for the normal Atari video. Of course the separate Luma/Chroma was the way to go if at all possible, yielding a much better image over the HDMI output. Audio could either be the stock output fed into the HDMI converter with a 'Y' adapter or stereo if you had that upgrade installed.

[Brentarian]

1 hour ago, mytek said:

This should be pretty economical when used on multiple computers who share a common monitor.

C0pperdragon also has modules for the 2600, Vic20/64, TMS based (CV, TI994A), and Spectrum.  I wonder if the TMS version would work (fit) in your CV NUC+.

[+mytek]

4 hours ago, Brentarian said:

C0pperdragon also has modules for the 2600, Vic20/64, TMS based (CV, TI994A), and Spectrum.  I wonder if the TMS version would work (fit) in your CV NUC+.

Good question, and something worth investigating.