Rom Hunter Posted May 13, 2005 Share Posted May 13, 2005 (edited) Great game, Bob! I call it: "Freeway with freedom". Some suggestions: - The already mentioned speed-up button (to move faster for 1 or 2 seconds) really adds depth to the game. If the small fishies are able to escape quickly, you must be able to do so as well. - No fish is faster than the shark. It makes the shark special. - Perhaps the jellyfish can move in "wavy" patterns or even vertically? It makes them more specific. - What about a "night version" with the moon instead of the sun and darker colours? - Maybe a bigger fish can stop moving for a while. When your fish is in its "sight" it starts swimming quickly towards you. Or not... - Beware: after 2000 points the gameplay comes down to waiting at the bottom of the ocean and triggering a low-level fish. The game becomes "Freeway without freedom" and that's not what you want, is it? A slow moving crab will do the trick... Keep up the good work! Edited May 14, 2005 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nathan Strum Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 - Beware: after 2000 points the gameplay comes down to waiting at the bottom of the ocean and triggering a low-level fish. The game becomes "Freeway without freedom" and that's not what you want, is it? A slow moving crab will do the trick... I found that happened to me, too. Once you get to a certain size, it's too easy to just sit on the bottom and wait for low-flying (swimming) targets. There needs to be an incentive for you to keep eating, or to stay off the bottom, or both. It reminds me of lurking for saucers in Asteroids. After Atari caught on to what gamers were doing, they changed the saucer so it targeted the remaining rock(s), forcing you to the next level. Maybe you could have something like that... a fish that comes by and spits at you if you stay in one spot too long. Also, when your fish gets really big, the shark (though deadly) doesn't appear so menacing, since he's so much smaller. Would it work to make him bigger? The same size as some of the larger fish maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacob Rose Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 (edited) Latest version. Getting very close to completion now... :) 854085[/snapback] I hadn't seen a snapshot of this in a while...having smaller fish "see how big you are" and run away is hilarious! The Color/BW music toggle is great, too. I prefer the game with just the gameplay sounds. It seems perfect that way, somehow. Really cool game! PS. The fishie looks a little odd when his/her tail stops "folded" flat...any plans to tweak that? [by "stops" I mean when you start drifting] Edited May 30, 2005 by Jacob Rose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmips Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 I hadn't seen a snapshot of this in a while...having smaller fish "see how big you are" and run away is hilarious! The Color/BW music toggle is great, too. I prefer the game with just the gameplay sounds. It seems perfect that way, somehow. I know there is no standard, but I had been using the Color/BW as a NTSC/PAL toggle on some of my stuff. Having a music toggle is cool. Would be nice to have a pause switch. Maybe the best would be to use the left and right difficulty switches for music and NTSC/PAL selection and then use the Color/BW switch as a pause. To prevent the game from coming up in paused you would just use the current setting of the Color/BW switch as unpaused when the game started and when you toggled it would pause... Really cool game! PS. The fishie looks a little odd when his/her tail stops "folded" flat...any plans to tweak that? [by "stops" I mean when you start drifting] 864067[/snapback] That's nice how that worked out. I like the folded flat look when you are drifting, kind of reminds me more of a seal but it is cool. Would be good for the tail fins to snap back out when you come below a certain threshold speed. I bet anything, that you'd already thought of that... I played with my nine year old daughter today on the Cuttle Cart, we both had a great time, although it soon escalated into a 'see who can bump whom into an oncoming fish' (I lost) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted May 31, 2005 Author Share Posted May 31, 2005 I know there is no standard, but I had been using the Color/BW as a NTSC/PAL toggle on some of my stuff. Having a music toggle is cool. Would be nice to have a pause switch. Maybe the best would be to use the left and right difficulty switches for music and NTSC/PAL selection and then use the Color/BW switch as a pause. To prevent the game from coming up in paused you would just use the current setting of the Color/BW switch as unpaused when the game started and when you toggled it would pause... Well, I am using both difficulty switches already, to change the starting size of the player-controlled fish(es). And since you can effectively pause by moving your fishie to the bottom of the sea and leaving him there (he won't be harmed!), I don't really see the need for a "pause" switch. That's nice how that worked out. I like the folded flat look when you are drifting, kind of reminds me more of a seal but it is cool. Would be good for the tail fins to snap back out when you come below a certain threshold speed. I bet anything, that you'd already thought of that... Actually, I didn't think of that. Interesting idea. I played with my nine year old daughter today on the Cuttle Cart, we both had a great time, although it soon escalated into a 'see who can bump whom into an oncoming fish' (I lost) That's how the 2-player game was designed; see who can survive the longest, whether by being a good evader or by being a good "bumper." Thanks for all the comments, everyone. Feedback is fun, and very very helpful! I'm gonna post the latest and greatest version of this in a few minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted May 31, 2005 Author Share Posted May 31, 2005 Ok, newest version: Changes: Gameplay tweaked to prevent "sniping" from the bottom...let me know if you can still do it It speaks! AtariVox speech code is in and working. Only one phrase is in right now; don't know if I will add more. If there is time/room. Some color tweaking. Added code that should detect the type of machine it is running on (2600 vs 7800) and read the B&W/Color switch appropriately. It works fine on a 2600; if someone could test it on a 7800 I would really appreciate it. And many thanks to Nukey for doing the heavy lifting on this code. Still to do: Minor graphical (especially color) tweaking. Music tweaking. More AVox speech? Get AVox high-score saving code to work, dammit! PAL conversion GoFish.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kisrael Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Ooh, I didn't notice a 2 player mode - reminds me of this game-in-a-game my friend and I invented for Mario Kart on Game Cube--on the desert level, see who can hang out closest to the whirlwind without getting sucked in. Except for the lack of a scoring system it was a great minigame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 1, 2005 Author Share Posted June 1, 2005 (edited) Added code that should detect the type of machine it is running on (2600 vs 7800) and read the B&W/Color switch appropriately. It works fine on a 2600; if someone could test it on a 7800 I would really appreciate it. And many thanks to Nukey for doing the heavy lifting on this code. That code had a few problems with it; thanks to atwwong for helping me test it. New version with hopefully-functional 7800-detecting code attached. Changed some colors, too. I put in a little time playing the two-player mode with my wife last night, and I realized that it isn't quite as much fun when one player is bigger. Not sure what to do about this. I might disable growing in the two-player game, but I'm not sure that's the best solution. Also, I realized that my "solution" to sniping won't work as it is. Back to the drawing board. GoFish.zip Edited June 1, 2005 by vdub_bobby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atwwong Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 That code had a few problems with it; thanks to atwwong for helping me test it. New version with hopefully-functional 7800-detecting code attached. Changed some colors, too. You're welcome; your game is a pleasure to test and play! All the switches and code now work on both the 2600 & 7800! Excellent job! I'm going back now to play the game on real hardware for a while... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmpddytim Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Is this still on track to be released at OVGE? I can't wait to get my copy! Great work! -Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 2, 2005 Author Share Posted June 2, 2005 Is this still on track to be released at OVGE? I can't wait to get my copy! Great work! -Tim 866024[/snapback] Yup. According to Al, I have until about June 10th to finish it up - and the only major issue left is the AtariVox EEPROM code, which has me baffled. But yeah, it should be ready to go for OVGE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHoboInYourRoom Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 (edited) Oh, wow! This new version is excellent! I love the new music! But yeah, it should be ready to go for OVGE. Damn the fact I have no money and no way to go there. Edited June 5, 2005 by TheHoboInYourRoom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 7, 2005 Author Share Posted June 7, 2005 New version here: This version is very very close to completion: Changes: -sniping "solution" is, I think, as good as it is gonna get. You can linger on the bottom and pick off low-lying fish, but it still will require some skill to avoid death. -all the music except for the title screen tune has been polished. -AVox high score saving code added...except it doesn't seem to work. See below. -change to two-player console controls: left difficulty switch sets starting size for both fishes, right difficulty switch sets whether the fish can grow or not: B=no growing, A=growing. Still To Do: -polish title-screen music and make any last-minute changes to music. -possibly add more AtariVox speech. -work on "wave" noise so it doesn't sound idiotic. -slight color tweaking. I still have plans to code a PAL version, but it looks like that won't get done as soon as the NTSC version. But we'll see. Depending on the AVox EEPROM stuff, I could be pretty much done with the NTSC version by Thursday. So it is slightly possible that the PAL version could be done by the end of the weekend. Slightly. About the AtariVox high score saving: I added the code, double and triple checked it, and even had some folks on the [stella] list look it over, and I swear it should work - but it doesn't. So I kinda wonder if my AtariVox is screwy or something. So could someone with an AtariVox check out this latest binary and tell me if it saves high scores? Thanks. GoFish.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard H. Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 So I kinda wonder if my AtariVox is screwy or something I'd test it, but I don't have my console at the moment (a friend took it on holiday ), but have you tried replacing the EEPROM (it's in a socket) ? To test if it's bad, hook up the PC interface, write a 32K file to it and then verify it back. If it is bad, 24LC256 serial EEPROM's are available in pretty much any electronic store (for about $2). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard H. Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 even had some folks on the [stella] list look it over Bob, I just read your stella post about being able to read the EEPROM from the interface after MGD had written to it etc, and just realised what the problem is. It's your cable. It's either too long or not sheilded enough (12C comms are picky). It works with the interface because the AtariVox is plugged directly into the unit (like the new cased AV). Try a PC serial cable instead of the sega extension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 even had some folks on the [stella] list look it over Bob, I just read your stella post about being able to read the EEPROM from the interface after MGD had written to it etc, and just realised what the problem is. It's your cable. It's either too long or not sheilded enough (12C comms are picky). It works with the interface because the AtariVox is plugged directly into the unit (like the new cased AV). Try a PC serial cable instead of the sega extension. 870368[/snapback] Thanks, Richard. And after a little more testing last night, I'm pretty sure you're right; it's the cable. I did get it to write last night though, with the same code, it wouldn't write two nights ago. In the process I also found a bug with how I handle the data I read from the AVox - but that won't be too hard to fix; just gotta find the room to fit in a little extra code. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 New version, hot on the heels of the last one! Changes: -should save high scores correctly to the AVox (untested) -hold down RESET and SELECT when you turn it on to erase AVox high scores (untested) Other than that, same as yesterday. GoFish.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard H. Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 I'm pretty sure you're right; it's the cable I'm 100% sure now Just took a sega extension to bits, and there's NO shielding in them what-so-ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nathan Strum Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 I have a suggestion for the "sniping" issue - undersea currents. You could add periodic currents that sweep you up out of the bottom area if you stay down there more than a few seconds. That could add an interesting dynamic as it pushes you into oncoming fish. Also, I really like the direction-reversing eels. That forces you to really be careful where you move and when. Could some of the fish do that, too? Maybe if they're a certain number of sizes larger than you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 9, 2005 Author Share Posted June 9, 2005 I have a suggestion for the "sniping" issue - undersea currents. You could add periodic currents that sweep you up out of the bottom area if you stay down there more than a few seconds. That could add an interesting dynamic as it pushes you into oncoming fish. That is an interesting idea, but it ain't gonna happen for a couple of reasons: 1. I like being able to effectively "pause" by sitting your fish on the sea floor. 2. I don't have time: Go Fish! needs to be done by Saturday and there is very little room left - and what room there is would be hard to use for something like that. 3. I think the sniping issue is mostly taken care of. I think. Also, I really like the direction-reversing eels. That forces you to really be careful where you move and when. Could some of the fish do that, too? Maybe if they're a certain number of sizes larger than you? Again, the time and space issue crops its ugly head. And, also, I kinda like it that the non-fish characters (jellyfish, eel, and shark) all have unique behavior. But thanks for the suggestions; always good to get a new perspective and some fresh ideas into my lorn torn brain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 (edited) Bob, I have played the latest version of Go Fish! You've done a great job with improving your game! It really becomes frantic. Too bad the "speed-up button" didn't find its way into the game, though... One last suggestion: Maybe you can still fiddle with the enemy fishies' speed a little bit. In later stages of the game I found out that some of them are simple unavoidable, even when you're swimming in the centre of the playing field. Don't let tactical gaming be spoiled by trial and error situations. (Archer McClean once said: "If you can only blame it to yourself that you've died in a game, then it's a good game.") Keep up the good work! BTW: Is T. Montgomery your brother? What's his full name? Edited June 10, 2005 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybergoth Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Hi there! BTW: Is T. Montgomery your brother? What's his full name? 871877[/snapback] HeckYesIDid | Greetings, Manuel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmont Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 Hi there! BTW: Is T. Montgomery your brother? What's his full name? 871877[/snapback] HeckYesIDid Greetings, Manuel 871880[/snapback] Uh oh, my secret's out. My name's Tommy, but don't steal my identity. And don't judge my brother by his brother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted June 10, 2005 Share Posted June 10, 2005 I promise I won't. You made some great music, Tommy. I even got the change to listen to your "beyond 6000 points" music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdub_bobby Posted June 10, 2005 Author Share Posted June 10, 2005 Bob,I have played the latest version of Go Fish! You've done a great job with improving your game! It really becomes frantic. Too bad the "speed-up button" didn't find its way into the game, though... Yeah...I never really warmed up to the "speed-up button" idea. Have one of the hackers here add it in for ya. One last suggestion:Maybe you can still fiddle with the enemy fishies' speed a little bit. In later stages of the game I found out that some of them are simple unavoidable, even when you're swimming in the centre of the playing field. Thanks for that comment - one of my main concerns has been balancing the difficulty at the highest levels. I want it to be very very hard, but not impossible or frustrating. I'll see about tweaking this a little. One method I use is this: Since you change directions so slowly as you get bigger, you can't sit in one place and then dodge when something comes at you - you can't get out of the way fast enough. So what I have found to work is this: always be moving up or down as you eat other fish; so after you eat a fish you immediately move out of the row where he used to be - so if the fish you ate is immediately replaced by a fast-moving shark you aren't in the path of said shark. Of course, this requires looking ahead and planning your path, which is difficult (I'm not very good at it, to tell the truth - I only last about 30 seconds at the highest difficulty). Finding slow moving fish to hide behind and taking breathers in the reeds at the bottom are essential, also. BTW: Is T. Montgomery your brother? What's his full name? He already poked his head in here to answer that, but just to confirm: yes, he's my li'l brudder and his name be Tommy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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