My Official Coleco ADAM rant!

[Tempest]

I keep seeing certain games mixed into the ADAM files. Has anyone run these to see if there are really different versions from the CV versions?: Campaign 84, Evolution, Gateway to Apshai (I know about Temple)? Is there a difference between Troll's Tale tape(25k) and disk versions(376k) because the disk version is listed as being much larger?

 

I've got these that I didn't see on those other pages: Modem Chess -(play without the modem). Zork 1, 2 and 3 which I believe have to be run under CP/M. I've never tried them.

 

Modem_Chess__Play_Without_The_Modem__coleco_Adam_.zipzork1.zipzork2.zipzork3.zip

 

Most of the early Infocom games were ported to CP/M. I think Starcross was the last one they did.

 

Tempest

[pocketmego]

I figured you guys would want to see this...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sqfP5c864c

 

and

 

 

"Cathy, your doing awful in school, as a reward your father and I are getting you an Adam. We spend some money on it, so we are hoping you will be using it well into college. It was either this or one of those new Macintoshes, but we know this is the computer that is really going to stick around"

 

 

-Ray

Edited September 16, 2006 by pocketmego

[Pixelboy]

Has anyone been able to download any Adam files from allstargaming.net? I press the two "vote" buttons (and get the pop-ups) before pressing the "download file" button, but I get an unspecified error when I reach the next page (where the actual link to the file is supposed to appear). Could the Norton Internet Security I have installed on my machine be part of the problem?

[Dave Farquhar]

Sorry to pull the discussion back around to why it failed (I hope no one minds)--didn't Coleco have difficulty delivering the Adam in quantity at first also? I know when the Adam was released, it was a lot easier to find Commodores than Adams. So I'm not sure that everyone who wanted one would have been able to get one.

 

The bugs didn't have to be fatal--Commodore struggled mightily with the 64 and the 1541 disk drive. And there were things about both machines that they never did get quite right. The difference probably was that Coleco ran out of money about 8 years before Commodore did.

 

I also wonder if selling the integrated system may have hurt Coleco. At $595, the Adam was price-competitive with a complete C-64 system, but you could get a bare 64 for $199. You couldn't do much with it except hook it up to a TV and play cartridge games, but some budgets would have been able to better absorb buying the bare 64, then adding a disk and/or tape drive and printer and stuff down the line. And Commodore offered several printers at several price points. Mind you, they were junk, but you could pick the one that met your budget and your needs the best. I know Commodore played up the expandability/upgradability of its computers, but I can't remember if any of those ads targeted Coleco.

 

But Commodore was pretty much the thorn in everyone's side. Including its own.

 

The Adam may very well be the most underrated computer of its era. Today, well, the quirks in these old computers make them interesting. (Will we be saying the same thing about Windows 95 in 10 more years? I dunno.)

[Vic George 2K3]

I'm only glad the Adam I bought for $300 in 1985 (the standalone model that originally cost twice as much) didn't have any bugs in it.

 

And I actually did use it for writing up some English class papers, though I really didn't like how the daisy wheel printer missed printing certain letters here and there.

[Bill Brasky]

I think we paid $300 for our ADAM, the standalone model. I don't know what they were selling for at other stores or if this was a blowout price. I think one of the reasons we got an ADAM was because our Colecovision died around the same time and we had already invested in shoeboxes full of CV game carts we still wanted to play. YES, selling the ADAM with a tape drive and printer hurt them, big time. Stupid move. I used mine to print out school papers. I remember doing it late at night or early before school started and my mom or dad running downstairs to see what all that racket was. The ADAM printer was the loudest printer ever.

[pocketmego]

Sorry to pull the discussion back around to why it failed (I hope no one minds)--didn't Coleco have difficulty delivering the Adam in quantity at first also? I know when the Adam was released, it was a lot easier to find Commodores than Adams. So I'm not sure that everyone who wanted one would have been able to get one.

 

The bugs didn't have to be fatal--Commodore struggled mightily with the 64 and the 1541 disk drive. And there were things about both machines that they never did get quite right. The difference probably was that Coleco ran out of money about 8 years before Commodore did.

 

I also wonder if selling the integrated system may have hurt Coleco. At $595, the Adam was price-competitive with a complete C-64 system, but you could get a bare 64 for $199. You couldn't do much with it except hook it up to a TV and play cartridge games, but some budgets would have been able to better absorb buying the bare 64, then adding a disk and/or tape drive and printer and stuff down the line. And Commodore offered several printers at several price points. Mind you, they were junk, but you could pick the one that met your budget and your needs the best. I know Commodore played up the expandability/upgradability of its computers, but I can't remember if any of those ads targeted Coleco.

 

But Commodore was pretty much the thorn in everyone's side. Including its own.

 

The Adam may very well be the most underrated computer of its era. Today, well, the quirks in these old computers make them interesting. (Will we be saying the same thing about Windows 95 in 10 more years? I dunno.)

 

 

I really like your take on things. However, the C64's ads seemed only interested in competing against Atari and Apple. They never seemed to go after Coleco. Probably because, as you noted, the Coleco just wasn't as available as the C64.

 

Not to turn the topic completely on its ear, but I have learned something in all this looking back on Home Computer history...

 

History is DEFINATELY favoring the winners of the Home PC era. It seems whenever you read anything about computer history, it skips over or devotes next to no space to the classic machines everyone actually owned. Instead it centers on the winners (Apple and Windows platforms).

 

You never see enough devoted to the C64, the Coleco, Aquarius, Atari...

 

That is really wrong, because somem of the games produced for those systems became some of the most famouse games in Video game history and those machines are the ones that changed the world far more than Apple and Microsoft.

 

If these machines hadn't gotten people used to the idea of having computers in their homes Apple and Microsoft would have been royally screwed. Let's remember...Alan Alda made computers safe for Old People!

 

-Ray

Edited September 17, 2006 by pocketmego

[Murph74]

I really like your take on things. However, the C64's ads seemed only interested in competing against Atari and Apple. They never seemed to go after Coleco. Probably because, as you noted, the Coleco just wasn't as available as the C64.

-----

That is really wrong, because somem of the games produced for those systems became some of the most famouse games in Video game history and those machines are the ones that changed the world far more than Apple and Microsoft.

 

If these machines hadn't gotten people used to the idea of having computers in their homes Apple and Microsoft would have been royally screwed. Let's remember...Alan Alda made computers safe for Old People!

 

-Ray

 

I don't doubt there is some validity to your arguments, but there are a few things you overlook based on the era. First off, computers were thought by the masses to be expensive-- anything cheap, was a toy. The Adam was on the high end of the 'cheap' when you factor in the accessories (maybe cheaper than a similar c-64 at the time). It didn't help public perception that it was made by a toy (and video game) company. I personally was able to get onboard with the Adam when it was $399 after $100 in rebates if memory serves me (4th grade at the time- 1983/4).

 

Most people I knew had a C-64, or some actully had the Apple IIe/c, and a few had the Adam. The break down was pretty simple-- it was all about parental logic-- the C-64 parents all said they weren't willing to spend Apple money but wanted their kids exposed to computers just in case they really were the wave of the future. The Apple parents wanted the familiarity too, but they wanted the same system that was being bought by area schools at the time (my own school didn't get computers until the 84-85 school year). It was a larger investment, but they saw it as an edge for their kids to work on the same machines at home and school, me thinks. My pitch to the parents-- and this is a big one considering the perceptions of the time, at least here in the Midwest, was that I didn't want the C-64 cause it would cost too much to add similar hardware to what Adam had with it, and that the Adam would allow me to do the same things as the Apple since SmartBASIC was AppleSoft Basic compatible, at a MUCH lower price! (Hook line and sinker-- I fell for that compatibility one with the best of 'em. Gimme a break-- I was 10!).

 

I didn't see a PC in school until the 88-89 school year, and that was 2 PCs in a room of 15 Apples. The next 3 years, it went pretty much 100% PC, with maybe 1 or 2 Macs added in by 1991-92 school year. I can't speak for everyone, but in a nutshell, the C-64 was a gaming computer in my mind-- along the lines of Atari computers, but easier to use. The Apple was a school computer, and the PC was a business computer. The Adam-- well, it was MY computer. It was all the others rolled into one-- and I believe that to some extent even today.

 

Murph

[Murph74]

Also, a note on trying to convert the Adam catalog over.... I emailed a couple long-time Adamites recently. Bob Slopsema (http://ann.hollowdreams.com/) responded this week and will be joining the forums shortly. In the mean time, I'm going to check back in with the guy who claimed the Adam stuff from me to see if he still has it. Reason being, and I didn't realize it would be this simple, the discs can be converted to images for AdamEm. Here was Bob's reply today... he can hopefully elaborate if needed when he gets to check in here.

 

ADAM floppies of any size (160k, 360k, 720k, 1.44m) can be read by a pc while running in ADAMemulator mode. First, you need a pc preferably with a 5 1/4" drive....or 3 1/2" (and I have had the best luck w/ a 486 or

386 - has to do with read speed); then you need to download the emulator along with a program called DCOPY.EXE This program copies the ADAM disks into the pc. With all but the 160k's, there are other utilities which take the larger disk sizes and translate them accordingly. As far as tapes, there is also an emulator program to transfer those to ADAM disks (using an

ADAM) and THEN use DCOPY to move to the pc.

[Inky]

Awesome!

 

I wish I could get a hold of some of my old ADAM contacts. I'd like to see what Lyle Marschand is doing these days (He was the president of NIAD)

[adamcomputer]

Also, a note on trying to convert the Adam catalog over.... I emailed a couple long-time Adamites recently. Bob Slopsema (http://ann.hollowdreams.com/) responded this week and will be joining the forums shortly. In the mean time, I'm going to check back in with the guy who claimed the Adam stuff from me to see if he still has it. Reason being, and I didn't realize it would be this simple, the discs can be converted to images for AdamEm. Here was Bob's reply today... he can hopefully elaborate if needed when he gets to check in here.

 

ADAM floppies of any size (160k, 360k, 720k, 1.44m) can be read by a pc while running in ADAMemulator mode. First, you need a pc preferably with a 5 1/4" drive....or 3 1/2" (and I have had the best luck w/ a 486 or

386 - has to do with read speed); then you need to download the emulator along with a program called DCOPY.EXE This program copies the ADAM disks into the pc. With all but the 160k's, there are other utilities which take the larger disk sizes and translate them accordingly. As far as tapes, there is also an emulator program to transfer those to ADAM disks (using an

ADAM) and THEN use DCOPY to move to the pc.

 

Don't know if this is going to work correctly, because this is my first shot at this forum, but here goes. I HAVE ARRIVED....I think. The above and afore mentioned instructions will get you to the pc world with your ADAM disks. As pointed out, the ADAM tapes are a bit of a sticky business as far as transfers. AND, I see that all of you really want to get ADAM programming for use in either ADAMemulator or for the native ADAM. Had no idea just how abig a group was out here and still interested in the ADAM. While I am not a guru by any stretch of imagination, I can find my way around most of the ADAM stuff and have an extensive bunch of stuff.....my wife says WAY too much, but oh well.....

With that i will stop blabbering for now and see if it posts ok [adamcomputer]

[Video]

Welcome to the Board dude

 

There seems to be a bigger fanbass for the adam here than I originally thought, of course, anybody here's going to be a fan of SOMETHING old. ADam's a pretty good machine, but sure got a lot of flak

[adamcomputer]

Welcome to the Board dude

 

There seems to be a bigger fanbass for the adam here than I originally thought, of course, anybody here's going to be a fan of SOMETHING old. ADam's a pretty good machine, but sure got a lot of flak

 

THANKS, happy to be here!!!! I knew that there was some interest in the ADAM, especially with those of us who put on and attend the annual convention; but no idea that there was widespread interest - makes me li'l heart glad !!!!

[Inky]

I have an ADAM sitting in my basement, with floppy drive, and paralell interface, and a ton of disks and tapes (Half the tapes don't work. Go fig.)

 

'twas a nice machine.

 

I'd use it more often if I could have a game room, but I have nowhere to put one, unfortunately.

[Rik]

That's tellin' him, Garak! Young Ferengis can be so annoying...

 

I know, I can't believe some of these young Ferengi have the lobes to post things like that these days.

 

Garak

Okay, calm down, the harsh critisms towards the ADAM,the reason for that is that my best friend got one for CHRISTMAS back when it first came out,and it wasnt cheap either,about $600.00 cdn,and they werent an exactly a RICH family, QUITE POOR TO BE EXACT,but the parents scraped enough money together fo it,which him and his sister wanted BADLY.And all i can remember is him(bill) my friend ,telling me they had to return the thing because of endless problems,and they wanted their money back,seeing the disappointment for the parents was crap too!Would i want one?DEFINENATLY NO,wouldnt use it at all.About the only thing i saw good on the system,was the keyboard.MAYBE there were some ADAMS that worked okay without problems,but it got a bad name,too bad,it had potential.Im blown away by the knowledge of the numerous members on this site,im sure an ADAM can be tinkered and modified with to make it a better functioning system anyway.Funny how ordinary people with no fancy engineering degrees have made faulty classic gaming consoles better,as well as AMAZING homebrew games that blow away the corporate originals!proving that fancy degrees mean nothing in the real world.

Edited September 24, 2006 by Rik

[Murph74]

That's tellin' him, Garak! Young Ferengis can be so annoying...

 

I know, I can't believe some of these young Ferengi have the lobes to post things like that these days.

 

Garak

Okay, calm down, the harsh critisms towards the ADAM,the reason for that is that my best friend got one for CHRISTMAS back when it first came out,and it wasnt cheap either,about $600.00 cdn,and they werent an exactly a RICH family, QUITE POOR TO BE EXACT,but the parents scraped enough money together fo it,which him and his sister wanted BADLY.And all i can remember is him(bill) my friend ,telling me they had to return the thing because of endless problems,and they wanted their money back,seeing the disappointment for the parents was crap too!Would i want one?DEFINENATLY NO,wouldnt use it at all.About the only thing i saw good on the system,was the keyboard.MAYBE there were some ADAMS that worked okay without problems,but it got a bad name,too bad,it had potential.Im blown away by the knowledge of the numerous members on this site,im sure an ADAM can be tinkered and modified with to make it a better functioning system anyway.Funny how ordinary people with no fancy engineering degrees have made faulty classic gaming consoles better,as well as AMAZING homebrew games that blow away the corporate originals!proving that fancy degrees mean nothing in the real world.

 

It's just like anything else-- software and hardware today are no better. First revisions are called First revisions because they are almost never the FINAL revision. Just like Sony, IBM, Microsoft, Sega, (add names here) still today, they find problems, they fix problems. They find improvements, they make inprovements. Coleco was in that same boat, but much earlier in the race. The technologies weren't perfect, the designs weren't flawless, but over time they got better.

 

By the 'R80' SmartWriter revisions, the system was running pretty smooth. I personally never had an earlier revision or saw ANY of the problems others complained about. But again, those problems seemed to be laid on the early adopters mostly, same as it happens today.

 

I feel for the family who went out of their way to get one early, and were let down, but that is why MOST people wait to see if a technology pans out as a must have-- Blueray DVD, PS3, Xbox 360 even to some extent. To compare the Adam at it's release to the Adam when it was axed, is like comparing a child at birth to the same child years later-- it grows and it improves. In Adam's case, there seemed to be nothing BUT room to improve from inception, and improve it did.

 

Also, as for the Adam floppies I mentioned earlier, no luck-- the guy I gave em too 2 months ago sold the whole lot for $50. Shame as I paid about $100 just to have them shipped to me.... So hard to find true collectors these days who enjoy the hobby for the hobby and don't try to make a buck at every turn.

 

Glad I found this place though, I think!

 

Also, Inky-- if you have all those discs, I have a 5 1/4" floppy drive for the PC you can have if it means converting them! Also, welcome, Bob!

 

Murph

[Inky]

 

 

Also, Inky-- if you have all those discs, I have a 5 1/4" floppy drive for the PC you can have if it means converting them! Also, welcome, Bob!

 

Murph

 

 

I'd take you up on that, but alas, I don't have a free 5 1/4 bay

[Rik]

That's tellin' him, Garak! Young Ferengis can be so annoying...

 

I know, I can't believe some of these young Ferengi have the lobes to post things like that these days.

 

Garak

Okay, calm down, the harsh critisms towards the ADAM,the reason for that is that my best friend got one for CHRISTMAS back when it first came out,and it wasnt cheap either,about $600.00 cdn,and they werent an exactly a RICH family, QUITE POOR TO BE EXACT,but the parents scraped enough money together fo it,which him and his sister wanted BADLY.And all i can remember is him(bill) my friend ,telling me they had to return the thing because of endless problems,and they wanted their money back,seeing the disappointment for the parents was crap too!Would i want one?DEFINENATLY NO,wouldnt use it at all.About the only thing i saw good on the system,was the keyboard.MAYBE there were some ADAMS that worked okay without problems,but it got a bad name,too bad,it had potential.Im blown away by the knowledge of the numerous members on this site,im sure an ADAM can be tinkered and modified with to make it a better functioning system anyway.Funny how ordinary people with no fancy engineering degrees have made faulty classic gaming consoles better,as well as AMAZING homebrew games that blow away the corporate originals!proving that fancy degrees mean nothing in the real world.

 

It's just like anything else-- software and hardware today are no better. First revisions are called First revisions because they are almost never the FINAL revision. Just like Sony, IBM, Microsoft, Sega, (add names here) still today, they find problems, they fix problems. They find improvements, they make inprovements. Coleco was in that same boat, but much earlier in the race. The technologies weren't perfect, the designs weren't flawless, but over time they got better.

 

By the 'R80' SmartWriter revisions, the system was running pretty smooth. I personally never had an earlier revision or saw ANY of the problems others complained about. But again, those problems seemed to be laid on the early adopters mostly, same as it happens today.

 

I feel for the family who went out of their way to get one early, and were let down, but that is why MOST people wait to see if a technology pans out as a must have-- Blueray DVD, PS3, Xbox 360 even to some extent. To compare the Adam at it's release to the Adam when it was axed, is like comparing a child at birth to the same child years later-- it grows and it improves. In Adam's case, there seemed to be nothing BUT room to improve from inception, and improve it did.

 

Also, as for the Adam floppies I mentioned earlier, no luck-- the guy I gave em too 2 months ago sold the whole lot for $50. Shame as I paid about $100 just to have them shipped to me.... So hard to find true collectors these days who enjoy the hobby for the hobby and don't try to make a buck at every turn.

 

Glad I found this place though, I think!

 

Also, Inky-- if you have all those discs, I have a 5 1/4" floppy drive for the PC you can have if it means converting them! Also, welcome, Bob!

 

Murph

Yes,very GOOD points,especially to never buy new technology,until the bugs are ironed out,and the price goes down,like the new BLUE RAY player,ive already heard a few problems.

[adamcomputer]

Yes,very GOOD points,especially to never buy new technology,until the bugs are ironed out,and the price goes down,like the new BLUE RAY player,ive already heard a few problems.

 

[won't include al lthe aforementioned posts as they are already here] A GREAT point made about getting the first edition or version to come on the market, BUT ! there 'should' be no reason to expect a bunch of junk when you are buying a new product. I got into the ADAM in 1989, well after it's introduction, crappy equipment and death. I have approx 15 of them here, some in boxes, many with hard drives and/or printer interfaces and large memory expanders; and have had very limited problems in the last 16 years. Probably like 3 or 4 data drives bite the dust, maybe 2 consoles which lost their video; but for the most part, a very reliable system used quite frequently to play with and for a small business my wife runs. Maybe I just got a lot of newer equipment, or only the very first stuff was junk. Heck, I even leave the hard drive boot tape in the drive with no wipe-out problems, learned that from Dale Wick in Canada - the ONLY 18 year veteran of the ADAM convention as well as a veteran programmer in his own right.

[else]

Maybe I just got a lot of newer equipment, or only the very first stuff was junk.

 

Clearly you must be referring to ONLY the hardware, because pretty much all the application software that Coleco pumped out was very bug ridden no matter when it came out. And if Coleco cared, they sure didn't show it. I don't remember them ever offering any bug fixes for anything -- instead it seemed like they tried to keep it all "hush hush".

 

I personally never had an earlier revision or saw ANY of the problems others complained about. But again, those problems seemed to be laid on the early adopters mostly, same as it happens today

.

 

You've never seen any of the SmartWriter or SmartBasic bugs? I've already mentioned the glaring SmartWriter line-and-a-half bug built right in to the R80. And the SmartBasic listing-inserts-random-spaces bug. These bugs are just the tip of the iceberg. AdamCalc messes up if you enter formulas beyond a certain row and column. I could go on and on. You've never seen any of this? How is that possible?

 

Yes, earlier adopters expect some bugs. However the general public does not. The hardware got better, the software did not. Coleco didn't seem to care, so the general public quickly left.

 

I'm not saying this to put down the Adam -- I actually like it quite a bit. But you need to take off those rose-colored glasses and look at it for what it really was.....

Edited September 25, 2006 by else

[Bill Brasky]

Anyone know the name of this drawing program I use to use on the ADAM made by Cosmi. It looked just like MSPaint with tools/brushes and colors on the left side of the screen. IIRC, it was roller controller compatible.

[Rik]

Maybe I just got a lot of newer equipment, or only the very first stuff was junk.

 

Clearly you must be referring to ONLY the hardware, because pretty much all the application software that Coleco pumped out was very bug ridden no matter when it came out. And if Coleco cared, they sure didn't show it. I don't remember them ever offering any bug fixes for anything -- instead it seemed like they tried to keep it all "hush hush".

 

I personally never had an earlier revision or saw ANY of the problems others complained about. But again, those problems seemed to be laid on the early adopters mostly, same as it happens today

.

 

You've never seen any of the SmartWriter or SmartBasic bugs? I've already mentioned the glaring SmartWriter line-and-a-half bug built right in to the R80. And the SmartBasic listing-inserts-random-spaces bug. These bugs are just the tip of the iceberg. AdamCalc messes up if you enter formulas beyond a certain row and column. I could go on and on. You've never seen any of this? How is that possible?

 

Yes, earlier adopters expect some bugs. However the general public does not. The hardware got better, the software did not. Coleco didn't seem to care, so the general public quickly left.

 

I'm not saying this to put down the Adam -- I actually like it quite a bit. But you need to take off those rose-colored glasses and look at it for what it really was.....

Very well put ,couldnt have said it better!for what it really was....... A HEADACHE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited September 25, 2006 by Rik

[Murph74]

 

 

Also, Inky-- if you have all those discs, I have a 5 1/4" floppy drive for the PC you can have if it means converting them! Also, welcome, Bob!

 

Murph

 

 

I'd take you up on that, but alas, I don't have a free 5 1/4 bay

 

 

Bah-- who needs CDrom drives?!

[Video]

Anyone know the name of this drawing program I use to use on the ADAM made by Cosmi. It looked just like MSPaint with tools/brushes and colors on the left side of the screen. IIRC, it was roller controller compatible.

 

That sounds a lot like G.E.O.S (Graphic enterface operating system) I had that for the Commodore 64, and I assume there's a similar, if not the same program for the Adam. Great program IMO, I loved mine, till the disk died.

[Rik]

Thats my opinion,

 

That's nice!

 

you cant compare the 2600 to computer systems,thats another thing altogether,

 

Where did I even specifically mention the 2600? For all you know I could have meant the Atari 800.

 

if you dont like my opinions,tough S$%t,dont read them,everyone has a right their opinions,HAVE A NICE DAY

 

Nor did I ever say you shouldn't have a right to your opinions, unless of course you're implying I shouldn't have one to mine.

 

By the way, let me give you an opinion on your opinion. I don't think anyone minded too much about you popping in here and shouting at all of us, "The ADAM is A PIECE OF JUNK,ALWAYS WAS..." However, what really was annoying was your questioning of how we use our "outdated piece of equipment". How about this for an answer: why not?

 

Since your stuck on the 2600, I can ask you a similar thing by using your sentence and changing a few words: "Besides,why screw around with an [Atari 2600] when there's modern [Gamecubes, Playstations, and X-Boxes] that out perform the [2600] to infinity.Sorry,but thats how i feel,and each to his/her own also.Thank you!"

 

Ah, well, have a nice day!

 

Garak (my apologies on the hijacking of this thread.)

Thats cool!!!IM not OFFENED in any way ,either,by your responds,i respect your response,you're the one who's OFFENEDED,if you're so EASILY OFFENED,and cant read posts with an open mind,the question should be,"why are you on these forums"im NOT afraid to speak my mind,and you cant always get everyone to AGREE on things,My opinion on the ADAM has nothing to do with the other classic gaming systems either!

Edited September 25, 2006 by Rik