7800 games that should have existed?

[Jaynz]

I think original titles were more of a draw at that point in time.

I' not so sure about that. I know that we see some conventional wisdom about the NES's non-arcade lineup, but the NES also had huge sales of games like Q&Bert, Joust, Donkey Kong (of course), and.. yes... Ms. Pac-Man. There was certainly a market for well-done arcade ports of hit games. I really don't see how you can look at the NES lineup, particularly in the first two years, and think otherwise.

 

Even a lot of the game genres you cite were... arcade game ports. Castlevania, Super Mario Brothers, Contra, were all arcade hits before they were on the NES. I mean, hell, you even cited TETRIS?! Are you completely unaware how that game came to the US?

 

But, here, if you don't believe me, notice something about all those launch titles? MOST of them were classic arcade ports. In Japan, they ALL were!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_game_console_launch_games

 

A lot of the games you're talking about wouldn't come until a couple of YEARS after the NES release (like, 1988 to 1989) and by then the Atari 7800 was done and over already. The 7800 had problems, but reliance on old arcade hits was NOT one of them, at least when compared to the NES.

[Rhomaios]

^Minor point: The Famicom launched in Japan in 1983, where classic arcade ports would still be an important thing for launch and do right. Also, it's a bit unfair to call Castlevania, Super Mario Bros, and Contra arcade hits in the same vein as Q*Bert, Ms. Pac-Man, and Joust. The former three are very different creatures than the latter three. There's no denying that Super Mario Bros (in 1986), Castlevania (in early 1987), and Contra (early 1988) helped do in the 7800.

[Jaynz]

The original launch of the 7800 would have had the NES with a very similar line-up in games. The problem wasn't that the 7800 relied so much on them, it's that they didn't have MUCH ELSE for round two in 1988 while the NES started drawing on a larger pool of titles. It's also quite possible that if the 7800 had really milked the 'arcade at home' experience, particularly at a time when arcades were pricing themselves out of business, it may have changed things, though it's hard to tell.

 

But saying that the 7800 should NOT have had Ms Pac-Man is pretty solidly wrong.

[Rhomaios]

The original launch of the 7800 would have had the NES with a very similar line-up in games. The problem wasn't that the 7800 relied so much on them, it's that they didn't have MUCH ELSE for round two in 1988 while the NES started drawing on a larger pool of titles. It's also quite possible that if the 7800 had really milked the 'arcade at home' experience, particularly at a time when arcades were pricing themselves out of business, it may have changed things, though it's hard to tell.

 

But saying that the 7800 should NOT have had Ms Pac-Man is pretty solidly wrong.

 

Agreed on both counts. In fact, the superior quality to NES' arcade ports are a definite bonus for me and many who think like me.

[godzillajoe]

How many of these were released already for the 2600, 5200, O2, Coleco, INTV etc? None of them.

 

• 10-Yard Fight
• Baseball
• Clu Clu Land
• Donkey Kong Jr. Math
• Duck Hunt
• Excitebike
• Golf
• Gyromite
• Hogan's Alley
• Ice Climber
• Kung-Fu
• Mach Rider
• Pinball
• Stack-Up
• Super Mario Bros.
• Tennis
• Wild Gunman
• Wrecking Crew

 

How many of these were? A whole lot.

 

• Asteroids
• Centipede
• Desert Falcon
• Dig Dug
• Food Fight
• Galaga
• Joust
• Ms. Pac-Man
• Pole Position II
• Robotron: 2084
• Xevious

 

I guess the point I was trying to make is what was the incentive to buy the system to get yet ANOTHER version of a game you've been playing 1979-82?

 

And I was off by a few years on some of them (Tetris etc.) but again that was a NEW game. You could say "mom, I want a NES so I can play Tetris" and you might get one.

 

"Mom I want an Atari so I can play Ms. Pac-Man" would likely be met with "You already have an Atari with Ms. Pac-Man"

 

So IMO, Atari screwed up by not being a little more daring up front. And yeah they ROYALLY screwed up by not working overtime to produce some quality games for "round 2"

 

No one bought a NES to play Ms. Pac-Man. They may have picked up a copy at a later time because they liked the game but NES was new and shiny, with the robot and the gun while Atari was Atari with Asteroids and Centipede.

 

I grabbed a 7800 because I wanted Xevious, Galaga and Food Fight. All new games.

[Bill Loguidice]

So IMO, Atari screwed up by not being a little more daring up front. And yeah they ROYALLY screwed up by not working overtime to produce some quality games for "round 2"

 

I would agree with that statement, particularly since they were locked out from most third parties. Generous development budgets probably weren't ever in the cards, though, and Atari was probably already supporting too many total platforms at that point anyway.

 

The competition was over really before it started once the NES started to take off, and it's important to remember that even Sega, who at least was able to match the NES library, if not in number, at least in quality, and also advertised heavily, really didn't make much of a dent either. In other words, even if it would have been nice for Atari to release a few Legend of Zelda- or Phantasy Star-level titles, it likely wouldn't have made much of a difference in sales, so using that potential expenditure of resources for other purposes wasn't necessarily misguided.

[Lynxpro]

Yep, not like we could e-mail them lol.....It made no sense to me then why those Atari arcade titles never made it home to the 7800

 

This is something I argue about frequently regarding what Atari Corp should've done. Kids expected Atari arcade titles to appear on Atari consoles just as they expected Sega arcade games on Sega consoles. For Atari Corp not to have understood that is something I cannot understand. The first thing they did - in my opinion - when everything was worked out to actually release the 7800 in Q1 1986 should've been to get a licensing agreement hammered out with Atari Games even if it took getting Warner involved.

[Lynxpro]

I think original titles were more of a draw at that point in time.

 

Certainly not another port of Ms. Pac-Man

 

Tengen's [ahem, Atari Games] port of Ms. Pac-Man was one of the biggest sellers amongst 3rd Party titles on the Sega GENESIS years after the 7800 debuted.

[Lynxpro]

 

I would agree with that statement, particularly since they were locked out from most third parties. Generous development budgets probably weren't ever in the cards, though, and Atari was probably already supporting too many total platforms at that point anyway.

 

The competition was over really before it started once the NES started to take off, and it's important to remember that even Sega, who at least was able to match the NES library, if not in number, at least in quality, and also advertised heavily, really didn't make much of a dent either. In other words, even if it would have been nice for Atari to release a few Legend of Zelda- or Phantasy Star-level titles, it likely wouldn't have made much of a difference in sales, so using that potential expenditure of resources for other purposes wasn't necessarily misguided.

 

The 7800 outsold the Sega Master System in North America by 2 million consoles. That's why Sega approached Atari Corp about marketing the Mega Drive/Tomahawk/Genesis. So all of that advertising done by Sega/Tonka for the SMS was a waste for the most part.

[Rhomaios]

The 7800 outsold the Sega Master System in North America by 2 million consoles. That's why Sega approached Atari Corp about marketing the Mega Drive/Tomahawk/Genesis. So all of that advertising done by Sega/Tonka for the SMS was a waste for the most part.

 

A huge part of that is that the Genesis was released just three years, if that, after the Master System. What was the point of buying a Master System when games like Altered Beast (released in the same year on both systems) were much, much better on the Genesis than the Master System?

 

Also, neither the Master System nor the 7800 (nor even the Turbografx-16) could compete with the Super Mario Bros trilogy. Gamers would have to wait until Sonic the Hedgehog to find a platformer that could go toe-to-toe with Nintendo's much beloved plumber.

[Trebor]

(nor even the Turbografx-16) could compete with the Super Mario Bros trilogy.

 

Poor Bonk...Even with three games, big forehead loses to big nose every time.

[Rhomaios]

Poor Bonk...Even with three games, big forehead loses to big nose every time.

 

Bonk may have done it had he been the original pack-in title. Keith Courage didn't have a fighting chance, though. By the time Bonk came around, though, the SNES and Sega Genesis had total market control.

[gamecat80]

 

Also, neither the Master System nor the 7800 (nor even the Turbografx-16) could compete with the Super Mario Bros trilogy. Gamers would have to wait until Sonic the Hedgehog to find a platformer that could go toe-to-toe with Nintendo's much beloved plumber.

 

Well, the Master System did have the Alex Kidd series to compete with the Super Mario Bros. series on NES. But the Atari 7800 still outsold the Master System in North America! I can only imagine how well the Atari 7800 could have competed with the NES if it had proper funding for more games, POKEY sound chip added, and Nintendo didn't use bully business practices.

Some ppl will talk about how the Atari 7800 didn't have Super Mario Bros. But what about other, earlier platform games with similar gameplay like Pitfall, Pitfall 2, Jungle Hunt, Tarzan, Spelunker. Those games were on earlier systems like the ColecoVision and Commodore 64, but not on the 7800. Think of those games "updated" for the 7800 with better graphics and more advanced gameplay.

Also, games made by Konami and Capcom would have been awesome on the 7800

[Jinks]

The 7800 must have never sold in Canada. As master systems and nes were everywhere and 7800 was only a number on some of the atari games on the flyer that came with later 2600 games. Just like the 5200 wth was that??

[Jinks]

I have no idea how the numbers say 7800 beat sms in north america.. to me it looks like a fantasy.

[gamecat80]

The 7800 must have never sold in Canada. As master systems and nes were everywhere and 7800 was only a number on some of the atari games on the flyer that came with later 2600 games. Just like the 5200 wth was that??

 

 

I have no idea how the numbers say 7800 beat sms in north america.. to me it looks like a fantasy.

 

 

North America includes the USA, Canada and Mexico. Canada only has 1/10th the population of the US, so maybe the 7800 was mostly sold in Atari's home country, the US. Maybe I should have said: "The Atari 7800 outsold the SMS in the US". We will never know the real numbers.

 

As for my own experiences, there was only one family in my neighborhood that had a SMS; everyone else had an NES. I actually got my 7800 at the tail end of it's life --- 2 or 3 years after I got an NES. I remember the 2600jr and 7800 still being sold in 1990 or 1991 at Kay-Bee Toys.

[Lynxpro]

 

Poor Bonk...Even with three games, big forehead loses to big nose every time.

 

There is a reason for that. Ask the Princess Mario is always saving about it.

[Jinks]

I remember playing hang on and altered beast on sms. Later on seen a nes in two friends houses. I was rocking my 2600jr.

I know of Canadas small population. I wish it would stay that way..people everywhere suck..

[atarian63]

 

Agreed on both counts. In fact, the superior quality to NES' arcade ports are a definite bonus for me and many who think like me.

sadly the NES ms pac controls like shit due to that pad. some games need an actual joystick, too bad that as it looks great,just plays bad.

Edited July 11, 2014 by atarian63

[The Usotsuki]

That's what the Advantage is for, não?

 

The Genesis port was, iirc, based on the NES one, and the SNES one on the Genesis one.

[+madman]

I have no idea how the numbers say 7800 beat sms in north america.. to me it looks like a fantasy.

I agree with this, I don't even recall knowing about the 7800 back then. I had several friends that had the SMS and I definitely remember seeing SMS games being advertised and in stores. I don't have the same memory around the 7800, last pre-Lynx memories I have of Atari were the Atari 2600 jr "under 50 bucks" commercials.

[Lynxpro]

I agree with this, I don't even recall knowing about the 7800 back then. I had several friends that had the SMS and I definitely remember seeing SMS games being advertised and in stores. I don't have the same memory around the 7800, last pre-Lynx memories I have of Atari were the Atari 2600 jr "under 50 bucks" commercials.

 

The 7800 was sold at Toys R Us and KB rather prominently. Hell, both chains gave plenty of shelf space to the XE Game System. And Toys R Us even kept the INTV3 on their shelves for a couple of years.

[Jinks]

The suitcase 2600jr was the only atari product I recall on a shelf. Besides the 2600 games.

Other earlier ataris were all seen in the sears catolog along with colecovisions.

[Trebor]

To get this a little more back on topic, I don't know about "should" have existed, but these Arcade games are good enough and (mostly) non-existent on other console platforms or obscure enough, that being on the 7800 - would have been awesome:

 

Pandora's Palace (Konami/Interlogic)

Jumping Jack (Universal)

Cheyenne (Exidy)

Do! Run Run (Universal)

Mikie [High School Graffiti] (Konami)

Mr. Do's Wild Ride (Universal)

Mysterious Stones (Technos)

Timber (Bally Midway)

Satan's Hollow (Bally Midway)

Express Raider (Data East)

Fire Trap (Wood Place/Data East)

Jail Break (Konami)

Black Tiger (Konami)

Galaga '88 (Namco)

Tiger Road (Romstar/Capcom)

Were any of the above logistically feasible at the time? Probably not; nonetheless, still would make for some great Arcade ports on the 7800.

[Rhomaios]

Would Galaga 88 have offered anything or gotten close to the Sharp X68k or PC Engine ports? My instinct is to say no. I would have loved to see the rest of those on it, though, especially Black Tiger.