FPGA Based Videogame System

[+GoldLeader]

I got mine yesterday!  I haven't had a chance to open it yet, though...

[roots.genoa]

I'll get mine today but probably won't have the time to touch it until January, since I have an urgent (paid) review to write... 😔

[schnuth]

Got mine yesterday. The biggest gripe I have is getting the 8bitdo PCE controllers to sync with the Duo. You need to update with a special controller firmware, and then monkey around until it syncs. I’m not sure exactly what I did but I was finally able to get my controllers synced and working. It was a real PITA. 

 

Besides that it seems pretty cool. I look forward to throwing my game collection at it in the coming weeks. 
 

 

Edited December 21, 2023 by schnuth

[Reaperman]

Anybody else still waiting for Duo tracking movement, or just me?

[Austin]

33 minutes ago, Reaperman said:

Anybody else still waiting for Duo tracking movement, or just me?

Mine sat for nearly a week and then was delivered yesterday.

[schnuth]

3 hours ago, Austin said:

Mine sat for nearly a week and then was delivered yesterday.

Same here. 
 

 

[+-^CrossBow^-]

I know this is also being discussed in the actual TG16 subforum but there is cross info in both here and there so thought this might be of interest? Someone has 'leaked' the image files needed for the Analogue duo to show the game images in library mode. I did attempt this myself the other day using the conversion script for the Analog Pocket and while I did get images from it, they were scrambled so I figured the format of those pics needed to be different and just hadn't messed with it. Good to see I don't have to now..

 

https://archive.org/details/library_202312

 

 

[dashv]

Hey folks, I learned on the Facebook group  “Anologue Console Owners and Fans” that there is a swap trick that can be used to get some Everdrives to work with the Analog Duo.

 

It worked for me with my v1.2 everdrive running its final firmware with the Analog Duo on firmware 1.1b.

 

Disclaimers and caveats:

I have no idea if this could cause damage to your Duo or Everdrive. If you attempt this, it’s at your own risk.

 

I have no idea if this works for all versions of the everdrive. Your mileage may vary.

 

Either I don’t remember the in-game hook to return to the everdrive menu or it does not work on the Duo. I could not get back to the everdrive game list menu except by exiting out and relaunching.

 

Here’s how to do it:

 

Insert a real Hu card, any game.

 

Run it and fully quit out of the game and back to the Duo menu.

 

Go to “library”

 

Remove the real Hu card.

 

Insert your everdrive (if you haven’t already, you will need to remove the plastic top on the everdrive so it will fit).

 

Launch the library item for the last real Hu card you had previously inserted.

 

It will load the everdrive and you should see your list of games.

 

Select your game and play.

 

using this method I did an entire playthrough of Street Fighter II, and about 20 minutes of Ninja Gaiden.

Edited December 30, 2023 by dashv

[Austin]

Yep, that was discussed in the Turbo Grafx thread. Works for me with some caveats.

 

 

Edited December 30, 2023 by Austin

[+GoldLeader]

Mine's a V2.5 so I was never able to do it,  but I ordered a cheap clone of (I hope) The 1.1 or thereabouts.  Hopefully it works!  Though I also think a later firmware update may let other Everdrives work.

[dashv]

12 minutes ago, GoldLeader said:

Mine's a V2.5 so I was never able to do it,  but I ordered a cheap clone of (I hope) The 1.1 or thereabouts.  Hopefully it works!  Though I also think a later firmware update may let other Everdrives work.

I agree. I’m thinking either an Everdrive or Duo firmware (or both) is going to eventually address this.

 

It’s clearly possible to get them working. It’s just initial detection that’s wonky.

[Austin]

48 minutes ago, GoldLeader said:

Though I also think a later firmware update may let other Everdrives work.

I sure hope so. I'd love to see this thing be as polished and user-friendly as possible.

[StrangerInUsAll]

What is the thinking here for a possible Kevtris jailbreak release for the Duo? Seems a bit weird to have the Pocket enjoying the Kevtris cores and rom loading, while leaving the actual Duo without these functions?

[roots.genoa]

1 hour ago, StrangerInUsAll said:

What is the thinking here for a possible Kevtris jailbreak release for the Duo? Seems a bit weird to have the Pocket enjoying the Kevtris cores and rom loading, while leaving the actual Duo without these functions?

My theory is he's waiting for Duo's final firmware (the current one doesn't allow savestates for instance). Why releasing a jailbreak (which is an alternative firmware after all) if the firmware is not done?

[StrangerInUsAll]

18 minutes ago, roots.genoa said:

My theory is he's waiting for Duo's final firmware (the current one doesn't allow savestates for instance). Why releasing a jailbreak (which is an alternative firmware after all) if the firmware is not done?

Good point!

[Austin]

10 hours ago, StrangerInUsAll said:

What is the thinking here for a possible Kevtris jailbreak release for the Duo? Seems a bit weird to have the Pocket enjoying the Kevtris cores and rom loading, while leaving the actual Duo without these functions?

The Pocket uses OpenFPGA, while the DUO does not. I wouldn’t expect added cores on the DUO.

 

I hope to eventually see a jailbreak. But like it’s been said, the base firmware needs to be finished first.

[Reaperman]

I think for jailbreaks there's also a feb preorder batch to ship.

It'd be a shame if something like legal troubles got in the way of shipping out a whole wave.

Especially since it'll be the sensible people who actually waited for reviews.

 

I suspect this whole jailbreak scenario could get pretty easily busted open with a few depositions and turn pretty nasty.

And I'm quite glad nobody's even attempted to ruin the commercial-FPGA fun-train yet. (that I've heard)

 

 

I think next time analogue does a special-color-pocket run of some flavor I'll get in on that. I could use a second one, even if it is more hassle to keep up to date. Just ask my second MiSTer...

Edited January 15 by Reaperman

[Atariboy]

The patents are long expired. They're at no legal risk recreating in FPGA what's now in the public domain.

[hyrulebr]

11 hours ago, StrangerInUsAll said:

What is the thinking here for a possible Kevtris jailbreak release for the Duo? Seems a bit weird to have the Pocket enjoying the Kevtris cores and rom loading, while leaving the actual Duo without these functions?

 

In my opinion Analogue is making jailbreaking difficult with each release, probably avoiding legal issues.  But if the Duo receive a jailbreak will not be by Kevtris because he said that analogue hired another guy to do this project.

[Reaperman]

1 hour ago, Atariboy said:

The patents are long expired. They're at no legal risk recreating in FPGA what's now in the public domain.

Patents certainly wouldn't be at issue. My understanding is very incomplete, but the law allows a lot of civil beat-ups. Copyright protection circumvention and even trademark could be solid enough issues for an initial basis, with how close these names are getting to the original products. First would be an injunction to stop shipping more consoles until legal issues complete. Then a couple sworn depositions tying jailbreak to manufacturer, and now there's a product designed to facilitate piracy of games, that can be tied to a legit company with an address and actual assets to go after. as long as they start off with a plausible enough legal basis to go forward with discovery, it could start looking really bad fast.

 

For example, that gameboy bootrom check gets circumvented to boot original game boy titles on pocket--a poor example, since the protection goes the wrong direction. but maybe it doesn't even matter how that check is skipped, it sounds legit enough for discovery, "let's see how you're doing it." And now they get access to everything they want. Hardware, people, code. Oh it can be fought, uphill, anything can. But even after fighting through all that--even winning the whole thing, well here comes another legal battle. 

 

 

 

^that would be my worst fear.  The old 'and let's keep doing this until they run out of money and go broke, or at least stop releasing fun products.'

Edited January 15 by Reaperman

[Kaide]

1 hour ago, Reaperman said:

For example, that gameboy bootrom check gets circumvented to boot original game boy titles on pocket--a poor example, since the protection goes the wrong direction. but maybe it doesn't even matter how that check is skipped, it sounds legit enough for discovery, "let's see how you're doing it." And now they get access to everything they want. Hardware, people, code. Oh it can be fought, uphill, anything can. But even after fighting through all that--even winning the whole thing, well here comes another legal battle. 

 

This is a bit of a murky area once the DMCA gets involved. However, this particular argument you put forward was tried by Sony against Virtual Game Station and failed. In that case, VGS was doing a check for CD-Rs and rejecting them. While not the same thing as the anti-piracy check Sony did, it was hard to say that VGS encouraged piracy when it only played the pressed discs that made Sony money. Since the Pocket only plays carts out of the box, and it is no more susceptible to piracy than the hardware it emulates, this argument would play out before it ever goes to discovery due to the clear precedent available here. I really would be surprised if this argument led to discovery on other issues, because it’s such a simple argument that could be made to the judge based on similar precedent. 

 

I would call this scenario a fishing expedition, and any lawyer worth their salt would be pushing back on such a thing during the initial hearings. Precisely because it is the cheap/expedient thing to do. 

[StrangerInUsAll]

6 hours ago, Austin said:

The Pocket uses OpenFPGA, while the DUO does not. I wouldn’t expect added cores on the DUO.

 

I hope to eventually see a jailbreak. But like it’s been said, the base firmware needs to be finished first.

The NT Mini and Mega SG also did not have Open FPGA yet got all kind of different cores. But my money's on just rom loading in any case.

[Austin]

41 minutes ago, StrangerInUsAll said:

The NT Mini and Mega SG also did not have Open FPGA yet got all kind of different cores. But my money's on just rom loading in any case.

You're not wrong. Here's to hoping more cores will be added to the DUO. I for one would love, say, a Neo-Geo CD core, considering it has a disc drive and supports the 8bitdo Neo-Geo controllers.

[Tanooki]

Huh the Mega got cores eh?  I never bothered to look into it, and the snes one oddly I think didn't get any which is kind of lame given its core is a 16bit variant of the NES that did.

[roots.genoa]

13 hours ago, hyrulebr said:

But if the Duo receive a jailbreak will not be by Kevtris because he said that analogue hired another guy to do this project.

No, he wasn't supposed to do it initially indeed, but in the end Kevtris created the PC Engine core.

 

3 hours ago, Tanooki said:

Huh the Mega got cores eh?

The Mega Sg got cores that were already included thanks to its adapters (Master System, Game Gear, and SG-1000). It just got ColecoVision as a bonus since it's almost identical to the SG-1000 in terms of hardware. But it didn't happen for the Super Nt since there's no hardware related to the Super NES they could add. So in the case of the Duo, there's no particular reason we should get additional cores, even though the CD drive makes it "convenient" to add NeoGeo CD indeed. I'm not even sure SEGA CD could be a possibility unfortunately, since it may require a bigger FPGA.