EmuParadise has removed its entire library of retro game ROMs and ISOs

[Flojomojo]

And here's the united states supreme court ruling that says illegal copies cannot be regarded as stolen.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowling_v._United_States_(1985)

That's a legal/technical/semantic distinction without a difference. What's next, "collusion is not a crime?"

[mr_me]

Having an illegal copy is not a crime. That's only a few posts back. The difference is you can be arrested for criminal copyright infringement and possibly go to jail.

Edited September 2, 2018 by mr_me

[Flojomojo]

Having an illegal copy is not a crime. That's only a few posts back. The difference is you can be arrested for criminal copyright infringement.

I'm not a lawyer, and neither are you. What's the point of this neverending bickerfest?

[JBerel]

 

 

Avast ye tender hearted daisies. Be ye pirates or lilly livered sissies!

 

Edited September 2, 2018 by JBerel

[atarilovesyou]

i think his point is that a lot of people on this forum and in this hobby practice all manner of mental gymnastics and ridiculous false equivalences to justify said illegal activity as it it were, in fact, legal and permitted. So while you may get annoyed at the repeated insistence that it is illegal, there are other who in the opposite way get annoyed by people perpetuating elaborately concocted , completely fabricated justifications to absolve them of wrongdoing.

 

"But if I download from a server located in the Netherlands, after 9pm on the 14th of September using a proxy server it's totally legal!" Man, stop it. Copyright infringement is illegal, and enforceable in every industrialized nation on earth. We're all pirates. Stop lying to yourself, and looking for make believe loopholes to absolve your sins.

It's a zero-sum game, really. First, everyone knows (or reasonably should know) it's illegal. We also know that absolutely NOTHING is going to happen to anybody illegally using these ROMs (so long as they aren't trying to profit from them), so there is no danger there.

 

And just like that, that's that.

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

Hahahah ok.

 

 

Guys, are the two of you telling me that you actually think downloading ROMs and downloading games that you didn't buy, is LEGAL? Just want to get a YES or NO on this... for my own enjoyment in this discussion. I don't want a talk-around... just a simple YES and NO.

 

 

YES or NO

 

Do you believe downloading old ROMs and games you never paid for, is LEGAL?

 

 

 

Look, we all do it to some extent, no judgement here... hahaha.

No, it's illegal.

 

Yes, everybody does it.

 

Yes, nobody gives a shit. It's unenforced, like Jaywalking.

 

I have fully loaded everdrives. I jaywalk.

 

Both are illegal, but nobody gives a shit.

 

Murder is also illegal. If I commit murder, they will hunt me down and lock me up.

 

Not all crimes are committed equal. Jaywalking and rom sharing (for obsolete systems) are essentially victimless crimes.

 

Murder by definition has a victim. If I commit murder, I will get prosecuted. If I download roms or cross a street outside of a designated crosswalk, nobody gives a shit. I have jaywalked in front of parked squad cars. The cops really don't care. If I walk up to a cop and tell them i have fully loaded everdrives, they still won't give a shit. They have bigger fish to fry.

[youxia]

It is a "victimless crime" as long as we also try to give something back and keep the balance. I know quite a few assholes who basically never buy anything and just freeload all the way, then gloat about it. That's just wrong and it feeds into the other side's narrative about killing the industry.

 

I believe that if everybody who "steals" also contributes appropiately to their means, both sides can keep the status quo. I think most of my pirating peers do just that, after all piracy has been around as long as the media itself and yet the latter is hardly dying - to the contrary.

[Andromeda Stardust]

It is a "victimless crime" as long as we also try to give something back and keep the balance. I know quite a few assholes who basically never buy anything and just freeload all the way, then gloat about it. That's just wrong and it feeds into the other side's narrative about killing the industry.

 

I believe that if everybody who "steals" also contributes appropiately to their means, both sides can keep the status quo. I think most of my pirating peers do just that, after all piracy has been around as long as the media itself and yet the latter is hardly dying - to the contrary.

A guy at work does that. He spent literally hours configuring a gaming PC to tweak a Wii-U emulator to run Breath of the Wild. He said the overworld ran to slow but the Shrines ran at full speed, so he had to throttle the frame rates to two different settings in order to run the game properly depending upon environment. Then he played it for 45 minutes on a shitty barely functional emulator. He said he got tired and quit after he acquired the parasail and left the great plateau. I told him to just skip the emulation shit, go out and buy a Switch.

 

He will even torrent Chinese bootlegs of American movies while they are still in theaters, often filmed in a crowded theater where some guy set up a tripod (apparently this is acceptible behavior in China?) and filmed the entire thing. Aspect ratios messed up, foreign audience laugh track, screens crooked, cropped and/or matted, camera shake, peeps walking in front of the camera, and the entire end credits cut off (including like three cutscenes in deadpool 2). Nevermind most movies get censored in China, plus the Chinese subtitles on the screen for the English dubs. Dude is too cheap / lame to buy an effing ticket at the box office...

 

I feel quality is worth paying for. I also honestly spend more than I should on games. For instance, I have purchased Super Mario Brothers soooo many times...

 

Super Mario Bros (NES), Super Mario Bros (Famicom with custom hand drawn label), Super Mario Bros / Duck Hunt, Super Mario Bros / Duck Hunt / World Class Track Meet, Super Mario Bros / Tetris / World Cup (PAL), Super Mario All Stars + World (SNES), Super Mario DX (GBC), Super Mario Bros Classic NES Edition (GBA), Super Mario Bros 2 Famicom Mini Edition 21 (okay that one doesn't really count but kinda does because it was an official rom hack of the first game), Wii VC SMB, Wii SMB2 Lost Levels VC, Wii Super Mario All Stars Limited Edition, 3DS VC, Wii-U VC, Wii-U SMB2 Lost Levels VC, Switch Super Mario Bros VS (Arcade), NES Classic Mini, Famicom Classic Mini.

 

Let's see unofficial releases...

RetroUSB VS Super Mario Bros, RetroUSB SMB2j, Several Bootleg multicarts (NES + Famicom), Super Mario 2 Japanese version Famicom (AliExpress repro with SMB1 graphics), Princess Rescue (Atari 2600 demake) AtariAge release, sealed boxed and loose cart + manual, various hacks burned onto repro carts, etc...

 

So forgive me if I have purchased this game a billiion times already (likely A LOT more than most). I downloaded the ROM from the internet (whaa), but also have the capability to dump my physical cart verion using my CopyNES USB enabled NES toaster, so I don't really need access to the ROM I downloaded. Yet every time Nintendo reissues Super Mario, I have to find a way to download it.

[mr_me]

I wouldn't say it's victimless (depending on your use) if the copyright holder is selling or planning to sell their old rom files. But we are talking about old rom files that are just not available and may never be available for purchase from the copyright owner who may or may not even exist.

 

If you own a legitimate copy of a video game you are within your rights to have another copy for use on different hardware; no need to ask for forgiveness.

Edited September 3, 2018 by mr_me

[Flojomojo]

If you own a legitimate copy of a video game you are within your rights to have another copy for use on different hardware; no need to ask for forgiveness.

Are you referring to something like this, or just making up rules for your own convenience? I agree that it certainly "feels right," but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it were not backed up by law.

[mr_me]

This reference has already been posted in this thread, but here it is again.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/117

 

I don't know what you mean by making up rules, but I do make mistakes and do hope someone is kind enough to point then out.

[Flojomojo]

Thanks for that ... and that's an interesting resource.

 

 

(a)Making of Additional Copy or Adaptation by Owner of Copy.—Notwithstanding the provisions of section 106, it is not an infringement for the owner of a copy of a computer program to make or authorize the making of another copy or adaptation of that computer program provided:

(1)

that such a new copy or adaptation is created as an essential step in the utilization of the computer program in conjunction with a machine and that it is used in no other manner, or

(2)

that such new copy or adaptation is for archival purposes only and that all archival copies are destroyed in the event that continued possession of the computer program should cease to be rightful.

 

Note that it does NOT say, "it's OK to download a ROM from someone else if you own the original cartridge." I suppose this is where the "dump your own ROMs and it's OK, use someone else's and it's illegal" comes from.

 

Nintendo says this. It's opinion, not law, and they have their own reasons for tilting this way, just as users do for going the other way.

 

Can I Download a Nintendo ROM from the Internet if I Already Own the Authentic Game?

There is a good deal of misinformation on the Internet regarding the backup/archival copy exception. It is not a "second copy" rule and is often mistakenly cited for the proposition that if you have one lawful copy of a copyrighted work, you are entitled to have a second copy of the copyrighted work even if that second copy is an infringing copy. The backup/archival copy exception is a very narrow limitation relating to a copy being made by the rightful owner of an authentic game to ensure he or she has one in the event of damage or destruction of the authentic. Therefore, whether you have an authentic game or not, or whether you have possession of a Nintendo ROM for a limited amount of time, i.e. 24 hours, it is illegal to download and play a Nintendo ROM from the Internet.

[mr_me]

As mentioned previously, it does say you can authorise someone else to make your copy. It doesn't say anything about what copy is used to make that copy. It even says the program can be modified if needed to work with "a machine".

 

That nintendo statement was likely written by a lawyer. When it comes to lawyers, they'll say anything you want if you are paying them.

Edited September 3, 2018 by mr_me

[Andromeda Stardust]

i think his point is that a lot of people on this forum and in this hobby practice all manner of mental gymnastics and ridiculous false equivalences to justify said illegal activity as it it were, in fact, legal and permitted. So while you may get annoyed at the repeated insistence that it is illegal, there are other who in the opposite way get annoyed by people perpetuating elaborately concocted , completely fabricated justifications to absolve them of wrongdoing.

 

"But if I download from a server located in the Netherlands, after 9pm on the 14th of September using a proxy server it's totally legal!" Man, stop it. Copyright infringement is illegal, and enforceable in every industrialized nation on earth. We're all pirates. Stop lying to yourself, and looking for make believe loopholes to absolve your sins.

I think I made a pretty good comparison in and earlier post. We all break the law, but some laws (like jaywalking) are practically unenforced. Jaywalking is on the books mainly because it promotes safe road usage of pedestrians and vehicular traffic, as well as helps determine fault when a ped/vehicle collision takes place. It is more difficult to prosecute the driver if the pedestrian was determined to be crossing the road illegally and the driver was obeying the laws and road signage. But if the ped was on a clearly marked crosswalk when the accident occurred, the driver is basically screwed.

 

Generally when it comes to bootlegging, the target is the distributor, not the consumer. Meaning if you download but do not redistribute the media, you aren't going to get slapped. The people hosting files or peddling counterfeit goods are the ones literally talking 99.9% of the risk. For instance if the cops shut down on a bootlegger selling counterfeit games or movies, they are not interested in tracking down customers who purchased the goods prior to the sting, but removing the supply chain. The exception of course is true black market contraband such as weapons, drugs, or child pr0n. You will get arrested for mere possession alone when it comes to illicit goods, but possession of otherwise legal but copyright infringing material isn't going to alert the authorities if you keep it to yourself. Don't share your ROMs / music / movies with others or put it online, and nobody will come a knocking on your door.

[82-T/A]

*BREAKING*

 

Donald J. Trump signs executive order authorizing the open distribution of ROMs!

[Andromeda Stardust]

*BREAKING*

 

Donald J. Trump signs executive order authorizing the open distribution of ROMs!

Even if true, POTUS is such an idiot I cannot be shocked by anything he spews anymore.

[82-T/A]

Even if true, ….

 

Woah dude... not everyone here has the same views. Can we just have a little fun and not get so angry? Not quoting... just in case you want to delete all the stuff you said so we can keep this thread light and fun, and not get it locked.

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

Woah dude... not everyone here has the same views. Can we just have a little fun and not get so angry? Not quoting... just in case you want to delete all the stuff you said so we can keep this thread light and fun, and not get it locked.

I edited my post. Thank you...

[82-T/A]

I edited my post. Thank you...

 

Hah, that's not what I meant... oh well. My wife's a Democrat, so I'm used to this stuff.

[Tanooki]

This reference has already been posted in this thread, but here it is again.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/117

 

I don't know what you mean by making up rules, but I do make mistakes and do hope someone is kind enough to point then out.

That's what I've done for a very very long time, even when I still did actively pirate crap 20 years ago, stuff that I did own I still did make archival backups. I just remembered as that link said, run just the one copy, sell the legit and destroy the backup. I mean why not if you're done with it right? I've had a few cases where I've got games even now I have to use the backup because the media itself is unreadable due to one problem or another, but my zipped copy I can still decompress and run using some tool. Without that provision I'd have a few games I couldn't use anymore I do own.

[John Stamos Mullet]

never mind. Not worth it.

Edited September 4, 2018 by John Stamos Mullet

[82-T/A]

never mind. Not worth it.

 

Hahah. Glad your common sense won.

 

 

That's what I've done for a very very long time, even when I still did actively pirate crap 20 years ago, stuff that I did own I still did make archival backups. I just remembered as that link said, run just the one copy, sell the legit and destroy the backup. I mean why not if you're done with it right? I've had a few cases where I've got games even now I have to use the backup because the media itself is unreadable due to one problem or another, but my zipped copy I can still decompress and run using some tool. Without that provision I'd have a few games I couldn't use anymore I do own.

 

 

Man, I JUST bought the entire Ultima 7 series on GoG because it was $0.89, and then also bought Ultima 9 Ascension because it too was $0.89. I actually didn't have Ultima 9... never bought it, but I did have the Complete Ultima 7 on CD already.

[John Stamos Mullet]

Not common sense. I just didn't want to get banned from posting here because I got baited into a political argument by a troll.

Edited September 4, 2018 by John Stamos Mullet

[82-T/A]

So... I'm a troll now because we don't agree on politics? You should be able to not let my preferences affect your ability to associate with me on a video game message board.

[Tanooki]

Yes that's how it works in the US now, if you don't agree with someone, you end up being (pick a word) (end it in -ist, -igot, -phobe) and you're basically covered for having no further value in conversation as you're tarred and feathered.

 

And you do get it, from that last post I made you quoted. I've got a small amount of old games that GoG made far more serviceable so I use that. When I was speaking more specifically about stuff I have the old Explorer's Pack which has Civilization and Colonization for DOS and WIn, neither run today, but at least usnig DOSBox I can fire up the disc and run the DOS version which GoG stupidly lacks for Civ1. WIndows is still out, but if I could fire up XP on here, it would then work at least. Another that fits is Heretic which also due to licensing childishness isn't out there either, but I bought the finalized Serpent Riders release and use it in DOSBox or using a modern windows WAD loading frontend for it. I've got a boxed up copy of SIlverball 2 Plus! and one disk is more or less shot, but since it's backed up I and with a copy of the original floppy image that dead game still works bypassing it. It's a handy provision in the law that's quite helpful.