Is the IDE PLUS 2.0 still available (not at Lotharek)

[Marius]

Woah... That's a lot to think about FJC! From what I have read above about the "MyIDE" I had pretty much counted that out totally... It looks like we are all still waiting for that 'perfect' solution to come along - not to mention flash cells based on 'resistive ram'!!!

 

I agree with you that the perfect solution does not exist yet. They all have their pros and cons.

 

IDE+ 2.0 has very good papers, and I appreciate that interface a lot. I wished it had a FAT32 loader though, and I would appreciate it if it could 'break in' in a running program to make alterations to the disk config.

 

But besides that, IDE+ 2.0 is very powerful, especially on stock hardware; it has also a Real Time Clock.

 

SIDE2 + Ultimate 1MB is a very strong combination too. The PBI driver FJC created is a very cool invention, and it get's an almost unbelievable high compatibility rate. It's very portable too, since you simply put ATR files in your FAT32 partition, and then fire them up on the atari. That's very easy, and the SIDE2 cart also has a RTC built in.

 

MyIDE2 is indeed a different story. It lacks the Real Time clock the other two interfaces do have, and it also does not have a reset button, which results in switching off and back on your atari more. On the other hand... it has some cool features that the other two interfaces lack. If you are into coding, and you do cartridge development, the MyIDE 2 is an excellent piece of hardware to test your creations on, since it can mimic a cart using SRAM. It also can be a cartridge and a harddisk interface at the same time. FJC is right... MyIDE2 follows an obsolete and incompatible Partition table, that's a serious downside. But thanks to FJC's driver you can also use SpartaDos X with the MyIDE 2 cart, and then it supports the apt partition table too.

 

It all depends on what you want to do with your harddrive. If you are into gaming, you'd better get yourself The!Cart, which is by far the best solution for a huge (128 megabytes) game collection.

 

If you want to be as compatible as possible on stock hardware, and you do some productive things with your atari, get yourself the IDE+ ... you won't be disappointed.

 

If you want to upgrade your atari, go for the package with SIDE2. You'll get an awesome setup with Ultimate 1MB and SIDE2.

 

If you are into gaming, and into coding, and you want to stick with stock hardware, and you want an all-in-one-swiss-knife-smart-looking-cartridge-with-cf-slot solution -> go for the MyIDE 2.

 

A lot of choices. I must admit, I switch from one solution to another. At this moment I'm using my IDE+ interface a lot. It does a very fine job.

[576XE]

I think that main question is -> Is the PBI compliancy is ultimately equal to SIO compliancy?

I beleive that NOT!

 

SIO is internally supplied by Atari itself with all needed stuff but PBI needs drivers and another drivers and etc.

 

Even SIO2IDE may be incompartible to someone software because of drivers presence in RAM.

 

Is there are possible to make device that can't been seeing by Atari anyhow but standard way?

[drac030]

PBI needs drivers and another drivers and etc.

 

Que?

[Kyle22]

PBI devices are Plug and Play, according to Atari specifications. Their drivers are onboard, and take up no user RAM. It is not necessary to load any drivers for a typical PBI device.

 

It is every bit as compatible and normal as SIO, and works with almost all software. There may be some odd piece of software that bypasses the OS and does SIO directly, that probably wouldn't work.

[Marius]

Using PBI does eat memory.

boot spartados 3.3a disk version from SIO without PBI attached you'll find out memlo is $1900

 

Boot same partition from PBI and you'll see memlo is $1D00

 

That is 1KB less user RAM.

[flashjazzcat]

I think Sparta 3.x had to configure buffers or some such differently because of the way it employed RAM under the OS. That's an unusual situation, and not the fault of the PBI device. PBI devices typically use ROM under the FP pack, RAM in the IO region, and perhaps a few page zero variables which should not be used by anything else. That's it - nothing else.

[drac030]

Exactly. That is the entire point of PBI devices that they have onboard drivers in ROM so that you do not bother loading anything to handle them. This is plug-and-play implemented some 5-10 years before anyone else (AFAIK).

Edited May 7, 2015 by drac030

[576XE]

Hi friends!

 

At first thank you for exhaustive explaination but ...

The problem remains the same (Led Zeppelin).

 

Some programs uses all Atari memory by definition.

 

I say about Interlisp/65.

LISP has not ANY runtime primitives outward of RAM because of it's ability to redefine ALL of it's own primitives!

Really it can live only in RAM.

 

And as a result both cart (two of it) or screen area are under constant attacks.

 

I love IDEPlus 2.0 for it's exhaustive using of all Atari power!!!

 

I say no word against and never say it! I said nothing against IDEPlus 2.0.

 

And I even can't imagine how to eliminate this tiny local problem.

 

Really the Interlisp constructed as simple com file which can be like DUP.SYS.

FE like TOMS Navigator But they desided that no need to work whith this shit.

It was very raw at the times... And there was no 1mb extensions etc.

 

Are you see the real problem?

 

Is there a way to isolate Atari from unnormal programs?

Which is normal as itself...

Edited May 8, 2015 by 130XE

[morelenmir]

I'm really now leaning towards "Ultimate1MB"+"SIDE2" - not least because of all the practising I have done in Altirra with FJC's help! I have also been persuaded the need for a rotating disk in this situation is pretty much obviated through the cheapness of 4GB CF cards; even if it does wear out it is a fairly minor hit to buy a new one - unlike a new solidstate hard drive! I must say there is also a price concern - "Ultimate1MB"+"SIDE2" come for about £50. The IDE Plus seemed to be £100 on its own from the fellow I saw offering it. I think at the end of the day, while I would like the ability to use a cartridge - or emulated cartridge through a multicart - at the same time as the hard drive, it is not essential. Now I have a Happy 1050 in the post (albeit separately!) I can easily save to floppy and then copy back over to the Hard Drive if necessary. Nonetheless I think I will look at "The!Cart" as I will need a multi-cart to copy my many cartridge images on to for use. Is there any possibility that support for cartridge images above the 8kb offered through "Ultimate1MB"'s 'BASIC' slots will be added to the 'SIDELoader'? I think FJC said he was working on something to obviate the need for re-working the cartridge images themselves. If so then that would be pretty much the 'perfect' system I want.

 

Although it is not at all related to the "IDE Plus v2", my last consideration is to "VBXE", or not. I have sent off for a cable that will connect the monitor port on the 800XL to a composite video socket on my available LCD television along with dual-mono L&R plugs. Hopefully this will give me a better screen than faffing around trying to tune a modern television in to an old RF system. But... There is part of me that thinks so long as I am buying all this pricey gear from old Lotharek I might as well go the whole hog and throw the VBXE card in as well. My first degree - LONG ago - was in electrical engineering and I used to do a lot of amateur electronics as a kiddie, so the 'soldering' doesn't bother me. In a pinch I can fire up my father's old hot-air kit to remove the various chips pretty easily. I do however have concerns in making up a decent VBXE->VGA/DSUB cable and also mauling my case with a Dremel to provide an out-port. I have considered stripping the DSUB connector from an old, U/S PC graphics card and attacking that to the VBXE output pads, but that would still be a lot of remodelling and that is distinctly where my skills fail me. I am VERY bad at after-market fabrication and have a contrasting 'perfectionist' personality. Even if I could get it installed and working I think I would spend more time worrying about the ugly hole in my case than enjoying how good the new picture looks! Sadly it doesn't look like you can buy a pre-made cable either, which is definitely a niche I would have thought our enthusiast community might fill! Can any of you chaps who have done the VBXE thing upload a photo to show how you handled the VGA-out side of things?

[waryl]

Is it this, what You want?

[morelenmir]

Ahh!! Very cool waryl - yes, that is exactly what I wanted to have a look at. Many thanks!!! I see you have done it in the way I was considering - by cannibalizing an old DSUB socket. You've done it pretty neatly as well. Did you epoxy it as well as use the screws?

 

Do you find the picture quality is a big improvement over what you get through the 'monitor' slot? I know it has many applications to programming as well - but to start out with I think I would get the most use from the improved video connection.

 

I see you've got an Ultimate1MB in there as well.

[flashjazzcat]

Can any of you chaps who have done the VBXE thing upload a photo to show how you handled the VGA-out side of things?

Note the signal isn't (usually) VGA, but 15 KHz RGB (RGB SCART, effectively). Here's some pictures of the RGB jack on my 1200XL taken when I was fitting it.

 

 

 

All my VBXE machines have the same jack arrangement, and when I fit VBXEs for other folks I do things exactly the same way. The DIN13 is fixed directly to the motherboard, with the legs of the connector going through thirteen drilled holes, wired up on the underside. The connector is wired up pin-compatible with the Atari ST, so you can use a stock ST monitor cable should you wish, or I can fab a DIN13->DB9 or DIN13->SCART.

 

Fixing the jack directly to the motherboard rather than to the case has numerous advantages, both aesthetically and for reasons of easy maintenance and cleaning.

[morelenmir]

Woah... Now that is some really nice work FJC!!! It genuinely looks like the motherboard came out of the factory in that state. However it must have taken nerves of steel to do it to a 1200XL! I guess you use a Dremmel drill-press to get such tiny and consistent holes? So you have basically replaced the existing 'monitor' socket with an ST-compliant 13-pin DIN socket?

 

I'm actually going to start up a new entry specifically about the practicalities of the VBXE as I have a number of questions and I do not want to completely hijack this thread.

[flashjazzcat]

I ripped out the 9v power supply, rectifier, heatsink, and added a PBI connector as well.

 

To drill the small holes, I use a paper template Candle gave me, a centre-punch, and a very thin bit in the Dremel. The existing monitor socket is still there and fully functioning. The RGB jack is sitting where the RF modulator used to be, the case aperture for which was used as the starting point for the wider DIN13 hole.

[morelenmir]

Of course! The 'switchbox' label had me foxed as I couldn't place it - but you used that in order to keep the basic 'monitor' connection functioning. You've definitely set a high bar there.

 

Very cool!!!

[Simius]

The IDE Plus seemed to be £100 on its own from the fellow I saw offering it.

 

Exaggeration. £67 is enough.

[morelenmir]

 

Exaggeration. £67 is enough.

You are correct and I apologize - a slip of the key as it were. The price I read was $106.

Edited May 9, 2015 by morelenmir

[Pmetzen]

One more PLUS IDE 2 is to be had? Unfortunately, mine has broken.

[AtariGeezer]

On 5/8/2015 at 2:57 PM, flashjazzcat said:

I ripped out the 9v power supply, rectifier, heatsink, and added a PBI connector as well.

 

To drill the small holes, I use a paper template Candle gave me, a centre-punch, and a very thin bit in the Dremel. The existing monitor socket is still there and fully functioning. The RGB jack is sitting where the RF modulator used to be, the case aperture for which was used as the starting point for the wider DIN13 hole.

Jon, Do you have a printable DIN-13 template you could share?

 

Thanks,

Jay

 

[+Larry]

On 10/24/2015 at 6:24 PM, Pmetzen said:

One more PLUS IDE 2 is to be had? Unfortunately, mine has broken.

Which version did you have?

[flashjazzcat]

On 5/27/2023 at 3:30 PM, AtariGeezer said:

Jon, Do you have a printable DIN-13 template you could share?

Sure thing (attached). Unfortunately it has to be carefully re-scaled before printing, and the scaling factor escapes me at the moment.

DIN13 template.PDF

 

[AtariGeezer]

10 minutes ago, flashjazzcat said:

Sure thing (attached). Unfortunately it has to be carefully re-scaled before printing, and the scaling factor escapes me at the moment.

DIN13 template.PDF 38.79 kB · 1 download

 

Cool, thank you. I Have 2 VBXE's now to install, so this will be of great help to drill that out

 

Thanks again,

Jay