The Official Turbografx 16 Thread!

[Reaperman]

Anybody got any hucard rpg recommendations? Preferably turn-based.

I've got a flashcart on the way, so fan-translated shouldn't be a problem.

 

So far the best I've played is Final Lap Twin. It probably represents most of my time playing tg-16 over the years.

[+Black_Tiger]

Anybody got any hucard rpg recommendations? Preferably turn-based.

I've got a flashcart on the way, so fan-translated shouldn't be a problem.

 

So far the best I've played is Final Lap Twin. It probably represents most of my time playing tg-16 over the years.

 

Turn-based RPGs:

 

Order of the Griffon: AD&D RPG with 3D mazes and towns.

 

Lady Sword: Straight-3D dungeon crawler with an English translation. There are nipples in the game.

 

Double Dungeons: Unpopular straight-3D dungeon crawler whose claim-to-fame is the split-screen 2-player mode.

 

Necromancer: The first 16-bit RPG and the first game with Kanji. Mostly translated.

 

Cyber Knight: Mecha JRPG. I believe that it's mostly translated English.

 

 

 

 

Adventurey:

 

Neutopia: Great Zelda-clone with 4 separate worlds to explore.

 

Neutopia II: The sequel has one huge open world.

 

Dungeon Explorer: More of an 16-bit RPG take on Gauntlet, with a real world to explorer.

 

Dragon's Curse: 60fps port of Wonderboy III: Dragon's Trap, with improved music and backup saving.

 

Son Son II: More of a cute "Metroidvania" take on Black Tiger. Fully translated into English.

 

Makai Hakenden Shada: poorly-made Ys clone. Fully translated into English.

 

Bikkuriman World: Pixel and audio perfect port of Monsterland, re-branded with the BW license. Fully translated into English.

 

Cadash: Consolized version of the arcade game.

 

Tower of Druaga: 16-bit remake of the arcade overhead dungeon crawler. Fully translated into English.

 

Legend of Valkyrie: Another Namco arcade port, this time much more faithful. Fully translated into English.

 

City Hunter: Free-roaming exploration, similar to Zillion, without all the pass-code unlocking. Not much of a language barrier.

 

 

 

Strategy/Sim:

 

Gaia No Monshou: Some consider it "Langrisser Zero". Fully translated into English.

 

Populous: Solid port.

 

Military Madness: Famicom Wars style war sim in a lunar setting.

 

 

 

Digital Comic/Adventure:

 

Bubblegum Crash: Fully translated into English.

 

Maison Ikkoku: Fully translated into English.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Anybody got any hucard rpg recommendations? Preferably turn-based.

I've got a flashcart on the way, so fan-translated shouldn't be a problem.

 

So far the best I've played is Final Lap Twin. It probably represents most of my time playing tg-16 over the years.

Available on Hucard without the need for translation hacks? Not many. Neutopia I+II are going up in price as well, but that's more Zelda territory. I think Ys is CD-ROM only.

[+frankodragon]

There is also World Court Tennis which has RPG elements similar to Final Lap Twin.

[7800fan]

Ys is CD only.

 

Dragon Trap is a good game but it's not cheap. At this point it may be cheaper to get an Everdrive and have access to a hundred good games for under $100.

[Reaperman]

There is also World Court Tennis which has RPG elements similar to Final Lap Twin.

I think I'm actually going to have to buy that one. Since it's cleverly disguised itself as a common sports game, it should be very inexpensive. Did any other weird tg16 games get a 'quest mode'? Google seems to think it's just those two, but that mode is about the best way to make a sports game not suck.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Reaperman

[+Black_Tiger]

Final Lap Twin's RPG mode is great.

 

World Court Tennis, not so much.

[Eltigro]

Okay, so I saw yet another video on Youtube where someone is playing a Turbo variant (specifically they were playing a Turboduo) and they point out and complain about how it only has one controller port. Why does every video talking about the Turbo have to have someone freaking out about the one controller port? I mean, this video wasn't a review of the hardware, even. They were just playing a game, but they had to whine about the controller port. And I imagine most of the people who are interested enough to watch a video about it already know it only has one controller port. It's not like it's news.

 

It has never bothered me, but I guess I'm a weird one.

 

Anyway, this all got me to thinking. People have modded TurboGrafx-16's to have AV out, they've done region mods on them, and other things, too, I'm sure. But has anyone ever modded one to have more than one controller port? I mean, even if it was nothing more than changing some internal wiring, putting a TurboTap inside the case, and drilling a few extra holes in the front. Personally, I wouldn't want one, but it seems that so many people hate that it only has one controller port that someone might have tried something like this. I did a quick google search, but nothing popped up before I got a little ADD-ish and rambled off onto other topics. Just wondering if anyone knows of anything like this.

[Reaperman]

Okay, so I saw yet another video on Youtube where someone is playing a Turbo variant (specifically they were playing a Turboduo) and they point out and complain about how it only has one controller port. Why does every video talking about the Turbo have to have someone freaking out about the one controller port?

 

It's odd to complain about it in a game review rather than a system one, but NEC deserves a lot of its ribbing for making people play extra to play 2+ players, extending their controller cables to an acceptable length, saving games, or even providing simple composite freaking out (much less RGB). All while it was bragging about being cheaper than other systems back in the day (IIRC). The system indeed cheaps out pretty badly, and it's more painful today than it was, now that some of those required accessories have become a bit rare and expensive.

 

I came into this thread with a solidly negative attitude about the system, because I was sure I was going to have to spend a ton to upgrade my RF at the cost of being able to save. That's where I was a week ago, and it wasn't a happy place. Now I'm doing very well in turbo land, thanks to mickris' turbo backend wonderbox, but it does cost a good bit to make a turbografx as functional as all of its competition was out of the box--it's a fair criticism.

 

Note: I've been enjoying adult beverages, and will probably regret all of this post tomorrow.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Reaperman

[CatPix]

The RF only is indeed an odd decision... tho how many people used:owned RCA video cables BITD, or a TV able to take it?

The 1 controller port make sense in the Japanese PC-Engine, being so compact, much less in the US machine.

Tho maybe they conceived the controller port in a way that make impossible to have a second player port then plug a multitap on it without data adressing troubles?

[Eltigro]

As far as the RF only, I imagine it was far more common back then. I do wonder about how many TVs were out there when the PC Engine was first released that supported anything other than RF. It may have just been a cost decision, going with the most common connection and not adding one that would get used only relatively rarely. And honestly, it's rare that I have any issue with the RF output. Maybe it is better with composite, but it's always worked just fine for me. I don't think the TurboGrafx Games I play via the Wii VC on composite look that much if any better than the ones I play on real hardware via RF. I know this is something that is discussed a lot and people always say RF is terrible and composite is better, but I've never noticed enough of a difference to complain about.

 

For the one controller port, what percentage of games are multi-player... let me rephrase, what percentage of games are simultaneous multi-player? I mean, the sports games, yeah. Bomberman, certainly. Um... MotoRoader and Final Lap Twin, yeah... Double Dungeons and Ordyne? I think so. I think most of the games are single player. And the ones that are multiplayer, usually aren't that great. (Bomberman being an obvious exception.) There are some that alternate (Military Madness can be played 2 player with one controller, iirc.) Yeah, maybe it wouldn't have cost much to add another controller port, but again, if they were going with the most common need, like the RF, then... But I agree that it could have been a decision made so they could sell accessories. Maybe we could think of it as some kind of physical hardware DLC!

 

The controller cables are a bit short. And of course they sold a controller cable extension (I used to have one but can't find it now). But, as was brought up in the gargantuan Coleco Chameleon thread, I was usually sitting pretty close to the system anyway, so those didn't bother me until I decided I wanted to lay on my bed and play.

 

I don't know, maybe I'm just making excuses because I love the system. But the negatives that people always cry about in videos and such have just never really bothered me that much. It just feels like they're trying to find things to complain about. Now, do I want a TurboBooster or TurboBooster Plus? Heck yeah. Do I have a TurboTap and multiplayer games? Yep and yep. Am I being hypocritical? I don't think so. I feel it plays just fine on RF and although I have a TurboTap, extra controller, and multiplayer games, they don't really get used much.

[Eltigro]

 

It's odd to complain about it in a game review rather than a system one

 

 

 

And it was a one player game! They couldn't have made use of a second controller port even if there was one. So why even bring it up? It's like, "Oh yeah, we're playing on a TurboDuo, it's a requirement that we complain about there being only one controller port."

[+Black_Tiger]

Even during the 32-bit generation, lots of people bought RF switches or had to line their console through a vcr to play on their TVs. RF modulators were also a hot item in classified ads.

 

During the 16-bit generation, composite was an exotic mysterious cable that most people didn't recognize, let alone had TVs which accepted it.

 

 

As for the Tap/single control port, I don't have the time to get into it, but it's been discussed to death for decades now. In my hometown, a Tap and extra Pad cost roughly the same as a single Genesis pad. There are lots of comparable "gouges" that can be pointed out about Sega and Nintendo systems, but it's all not a big deal.

 

What's more important, is that even the relatively small Turbo library has the best 4+ player game selection of the generation and any single Bomberman or Dungeon Explorer game alone justifies the Tap and extra pads. I say this as someone who had 5 pads and friends (of various console war sides) who had more fun playing Motoroader, Bomberman and '93 and Dungeon Explorer and 'II than any other 16-bit multiplayer experience.

 

People casually trying out the TG-16 for the first time and not giving games enough play time to appreciate them, tend to make random superficial comments before moving onto something else.

[CatPix]

I rememeber reading the manual for my PS2, and a RF modulator for PAL I (UK) was still an option

Apparently, the British brand Pye sold RF only color TV up to the 2000's

Edited March 7, 2016 by CatPix

[7800fan]

RF only design did make some sense in USA. When I got TG-16 my parent's cheap TV could only take RF (300 or 75 ohms) I didn't get a decent TV with composite support until early 90s about a decade later.

 

I did have Commodore 1702 that saw some good game when I got Turbobooster but I kept it mostly for C64 gaming because AV switch box weren't readily or easily found back in the day. And back then. my merger allowance didn't get me a cheap 2 or 3 ports switch box. The cheap box didn't becomes easily and cheaply obtainable until about PSX/Saturn/N64 era.

 

oddly AV switch box, even the component ones, are now hard to find new in stores, most people have moved on to HDMI and newer systems are HDMI capable so it's sort of moot point to keep old technology around that won't sell well today.

[+Black_Tiger]

Something else to keep in mind, is that Genesis composite (if you had a rare set that came with the cable or special ordered one) is so poor, that TG-16 RF is probably better. TG-16 composite is also sharper than the console of the future that is the SNES. The Genesis also didn't output stereo sound from its AV jack. You had to buy cords/adaptors and line it out separately from the headphone jack. And if you didn't have an early/launch unit, you had loud buzzing over your sound and all Genesis models would continue to have inconsistent audio. The TG-16 also does stereo panning, which the Genesis doesn't, and launch title Dungeon Explorer's positional sound effects are a good example of it. So the TurboBooster isn't simply a catch-up mechanism which costs you money you shouldn't have had to pay.

 

But any issue of "having" to buy a TurboTap or TurboBooster only really applies to the launch window of the TurboGrafx-16. Too many people take things out of context, because they either weren't playing games bitd or were a one-console kid with a skewed perspective. Around the launch of the SNES, a TG-16 + Turbo-CD cost about the same as a SNES system and came with all kinds of extra pack-ins or mail-away software. Even if you never played any CD games, a CD player back then was worth as much as a game console itself and the limited portability of the CD-ROM itself was still a huge deal at the time (I listened to CD music everyday in high school art classes), when few people owned CD players, let alone an expensive discman. And the Turbo-CD gave you built-in composite/stereo output, while still providing the option of RF output. It also supports back up game saving. That not only neutralizes the TurboBooster and/or TurboBooster Plus "gouge", but TurboChip and CD games were still cheaper than SNES games and TurboChips were cheaper than Genesis games.

 

If the measure of what real value or missing features are is how a console compared to competing systems, then isn't it actually a fair criticism that the SNES cost a good bit and wasn't even be as functional as its competition was out of the box?

 

But I don't look at it that way. I just appreciate the consoles and their libraries as-is, just as I did bitd when I bought them all and played everything I could get my hands on. I didn't complain that regular SNES games cost too much, even though I imported PC Engine CD games for less. I bought all of the most expensive SNES RPGs (which cost around twice as much as regular games), right through well into the 32-bit generation. When I still got a 32X, 3DO, Jaguar, Saturn, Playstation and N64. But I still see people continuing to nitpick trivial things about the Turbo line out of context, just because it wasn't the most popular console at the time. And games like Earthbound, Chrono Trigger, Super Mario RPG and Lufia II are only talked about as timeless classics, while the first thing too many people say about Phantasy Star IV is that it was so expensive (but retailed for no more than those SNES games where I lived).

[Reaperman]

Lady Sword: Straight-3D dungeon crawler with an English translation. There are nipples in the game.

 

I expected this game to be a lot worse than it was. I mean, it's not brilliant, but it's also considerably better than it needed to be. I wish they'd have worked just a little harder on the scenery transitions, since it's such a large portion of the game. Still, it's good enough that I'll probably even be back for more tomorrow.

 

For some reason this was the first thing I did with my new everdrive. Yes, *ahem* possibly a couple reasons, even.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Reaperman

[Eltigro]

 

oddly AV switch box, even the component ones, are now hard to find new in stores, most people have moved on to HDMI and newer systems are HDMI capable so it's sort of moot point to keep old technology around that won't sell well today.

 

My AV switch box is styled like the PS2 (black with lines/grooves in it) and has little name plates you could put above the selector buttons ("XBOX" "PS 2" "N64" "Dreamcast" and "DVD" are the ones that are in it... The others are "Playstation" "PS ONE" "VCR" "GAME CUBE" and "VCD"...).

[empsolo]

I think one of the main criticisms of the TG-16 add ons is that the add-ons generally add nothing to the hardware other than sound issues. None of the Turbo CD games I have played, outside of a small hand full of Konami and Hudson games, ever really approach the type of graphics that the SNES was hitting out of the park with its launch titles in 1991. At best you were paying SNES prices for a console that on the whole looked like a sharper and nicer looking NES. And NES's were retailing for about 50 bucks by this point.

Edited March 8, 2016 by empsolo

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

It has never bothered me, but I guess I'm a weird one.

 

Anyway, this all got me to thinking. People have modded TurboGrafx-16's to have AV out, they've done region mods on them, and other things, too, I'm sure. But has anyone ever modded one to have more than one controller port? I mean, even if it was nothing more than changing some internal wiring, putting a TurboTap inside the case, and drilling a few extra holes in the front. Personally, I wouldn't want one, but it seems that so many people hate that it only has one controller port that someone might have tried something like this. I did a quick google search, but nothing popped up before I got a little ADD-ish and rambled off onto other topics. Just wondering if anyone knows of anything like this.

 

It's odd to complain about it in a game review rather than a system one, but NEC deserves a lot of its ribbing for making people play extra to play 2+ players, extending their controller cables to an acceptable length, saving games, or even providing simple composite freaking out (much less RGB). All while it was bragging about being cheaper than other systems back in the day (IIRC). The system indeed cheaps out pretty badly, and it's more painful today than it was, now that some of those required accessories have become a bit rare and expensive.

NEC should have done what any console manufacturer with half a brain would have done, and included a second controller port (I mean come on, this is the freaking 90s and every console since the Atari 2600 had dual controller ports), then sold a four port dongle that plugs into the player two port to expand the system for up to five players. I still have not bought a Turbo Tap yet, since I only have one friend who's into gaming, whom I rarely see, and nobody in my immediate family is interested in playing with me.

 

I wish I had a working logic schematic for the turbo tap. Not because I'm too cheap to buy one but because if I get around to modding one of my Arcade controllers to support Turbo, it would be cool to have the player two controller simply plug into the arcade box, piggy back style. Are there any one player games that behave erratically with the Turbo Tap installed between controller and console? I have also heard that some Turbo Taps glitch up when connected to an extension cable. Is there any truth to this?

[Eltigro]

 

Are there any one player games that behave erratically with the Turbo Tap installed between controller and console? I have also heard that some Turbo Taps glitch up when connected to an extension cable. Is there any truth to this?

 

 

I can test out the one player games that I have and see if anything odd pops up when I play with one controller and the TurboTap.

 

Black_Tiger mentioned there might be issues using an extension cable between the tap and the console over on another thread ( http://atariage.com/forums/topic/249986-american-turbo-tap-on-pc-engine-duo-with-converter-cable/). I've never tried it, and having misplaced my extension, can't test anything out.

Edited March 8, 2016 by Eltigro

[CatPix]

I think one of the main criticisms of the TG-16 add ons is that the add-ons generally add nothing to the hardware other than sound issues. None of the Turbo CD games I have played, outside of a small hand full of Konami and Hudson games, ever really approach the type of graphics that the SNES was hitting out of the park with its launch titles in 1991. At best you were paying SNES prices for a console that on the whole looked like a sharper and nicer looking NES. And NES's were retailing for about 50 bucks by this point.

It depends on the games tho.

Like Super Mario World is really just a beefied up NES games, with some sprites being taken straight from SMB3 and added more colors/shades.

Plus, the SNES was hampered at first by the sluggish CPU inside. It might be a 16 bits CPU, but 3 Mhtz versus the 8 mhtz CPU of the PC Engine is definitively in advantage of the PC-engine.

 

And you have to keep in mind that you're comparing a console that was released in 1987 (and 1988/or 89 for the CD add-on) with one that was released in 1991. That's a 4 year lap, and this a lap large enough to say that the PC-Engine is one gen behind the SNES, technically wise. It's impressive that the PC Engine, with the RAM add-on, was able to pull games that would compete and equal some SNES titles.

Edited March 8, 2016 by CatPix

[Andromeda Stardust]

It depends on the games tho.

Like Super Mario World is really just a beefied up NES games, with some sprites being taken straight from SMB3 and added more colors/shades.

Goombas in Super Mario World look nothing like SMB3. In fact, they remind me more like the Strollin' Stus found in Super Mario Sunshine.

[CatPix]

Did I mentionned Goombas? I said "SOME" sprites.

And I don't try to reduce the value or qualities of Super Mario World. It is an excellent game, but it make sense that it is deeply marqued with a 8 bits feeling.

 

Pretty much like how Alex Kidd in the Enchanted Castle was made, from the programmer's own testimony, with the limitations of the Master system in mind, because the Megadrive specs weren't know at the time, so the minimum technical requirement were chosen to avoid rewritting/redesigning too much of the game.

 

They are early game, and as such, they have to show the transition between platforms of different powers.

[7800fan]

 

My AV switch box is styled like the PS2 (black with lines/grooves in it) and has little name plates you could put above the selector buttons ("XBOX" "PS 2" "N64" "Dreamcast" and "DVD" are the ones that are in it... The others are "Playstation" "PS ONE" "VCR" "GAME CUBE" and "VCD"...).

 

Sounds like Pelican or Interact brand. I bought 6 of them on clearance sale when they were still around and had them hooked so 5 were chained into one, giving me maximum of 25 systems to control. The closest I've found with this many ports were the broadcast equipment costing a few hundred dollars.