Rom Hunter Posted March 29, 2009 Share Posted March 29, 2009 (edited) As usual, excellent info and also very well described, Omega. All dumps added to the V5 collection and the Atarimania database. Many thanks again, Dino! I've added the Goliath Phantom Tank to our Puzzy section as well, because I'm 99,9% convinced it's the same ROM. I've changed the original versions from Bit Corporation to Puzzy too. About Puzzy being older than Bit Corporation: When you compare the cart label artwork of both companies, you'll discover that the Bit Corporation artwork of the cart labels is slightly cut off. Puzzy: http://atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?MENU...ERSION_ID=16442 Bit Corporation: http://atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?VERS...4121&MENU=2 The Puzzy cart labels show slightly more of the artwork, which points to the direction that the Puzzy artwork is original, hence older. Edited March 29, 2009 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaGtGruff Posted March 29, 2009 Share Posted March 29, 2009 About Puzzy being older than Bit Corporation: When you compare the cart label artwork of both companies, you'll discover that the Bit Corporation artwork of the cart labels is slightly cut off. Puzzy: http://atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?MENU...ERSION_ID=16442 Bit Corporation: http://atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?VERS...4121&MENU=2 The Puzzy cart labels show slightly more of the artwork, which points to the direction that the Puzzy artwork is original, hence older. Plus, both companies refer to the cartridge as "PG201," and presumably the "PG" stands for "Puzzy Games." If Bit Corp. were older, why would they use a cartridge numbering scheme that starts with "PG"? Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted March 29, 2009 Share Posted March 29, 2009 Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted March 29, 2009 Author Share Posted March 29, 2009 I've added the Goliath Phantom Tank to our Puzzy section as well, because I'm 99,9% convinced it's the same ROM. I'm at 99.9% too, but I'm leaving it on the list of games to be dumped for now, because... hey, you never know. I think it's important to verify no changes were done in this case as we believe it to be the earliest version of this game. Plus, both companies refer to the cartridge as "PG201," and presumably the "PG" stands for "Puzzy Games." If Bit Corp. were older, why would they use a cartridge numbering scheme that starts with "PG"? Michael I've thought about those numbers before, but never made that connection, lol. It is so simple. Makes sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 Up today we have some new Ample Ace sample carts from Dino. More information can be found on Ample Ace a few posts back in this thread, but basically they seemed to have at least been a distributer for Bit Corporation. There are two roms to look at today, and one of them is a new dump. SampleCarts.zip The Space Tunnel dump is 100% the same as the NTSC released version. Space Tunnel was released in NTSC flavour by Puzzy/Bit Corp, and soon afterward became pirated by many companies such as Zimag and CCE. Because of the Puzzy logo is present in the PAL Goliath rom; the Puzzy version seems to be the true original. Puzzy carts are very hard to come by in both NTSC or PAL format. PAL is exceptionally hard though. Bobby is Going Home is our next game. This game is well, a little like Alice in Wonderland without those damn rabbits. Believe me I did feel like I was falling down the rabbit hole playing it. It's a classic Atari game in the sense that you have no idea what the programmer was smoking. You guide little Bobby to his "house", but he seems to be living on the edge of dimensions. The actual screen with his house has stars zipping by between this universe and the next, and there is lightning striking. I felt mildly disturbed by that, but I must say the zipping stars are an impressive visual. Along the way to his house Bobby must avoid bats, butterflies, and jump over retracting bridges. There are obstacles in his way like teapots. Don't ask me what teapots are doing in the middle of the path, but I swear they are teapots. The manual calls them fences, but they are teapots. There are also the so called "rolling stones" (as the instruction manual calls them). These things kind of remind me of the Octorok's out of the original Legend of Zelda (NES). The big bird flying high in the background looks like the bird out of Forest by Sancho, and their is also a bird that looks like it was straight out of Condor Attack. The differences between the sample copy and the PAL Bit Corp version are as follows. Note there was some shuffling around inside the rom, so a disassembly was needed. - The color of the score display (which continually counts down) is darker in the sample copy - The Bit Corp Logo has been altered - The jumping animation is different - Some adjustments were made to the vertical position of Bobby - Shuffling around of the rom including a data table in a different place, I couldn't find anything else that made a visible difference First the jumping animation. "A" is the sample copy, while "B" is the released version. The front of the hat and the arms are different. Now the logos. What is really interesting is all the Bit Corp logos I could find were 100% the same. This is the only one that is different. The "i" and "t' are lower case, while the "C" is stretched. The first logo, logo "A" is the common Bit Corp logo. Logo "B" is the sample copy version. When I said all the Bit Corp logos I did exclude one. There is a logo stuck inside of NTSC Karate. That is believed to be a fancier Bit Corp Logo. I've shown it as logo "C". There seems to be similarites in how they chose lower case "i" and "t" while going with a capital "O". I've thought a lot about what comes after "CO". I think they were trying to shorten the logo to Bit CO, and leaving a ";" or distorted ":". I kept trying to make out an "R", but it just isn't there. Finally even though this "fancy" logo appears in NTSC Karate, it might have nothing to do with it. It appears to be garabage data, but Karate is a story for another day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Again, excellent information. Many thanks, Omega (and of course Dino for dumping the carts). So this could very well be the earliest version of Bobby Is Going Home known to exist. I'll add it to the V5 collection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 Again, excellent information. Many thanks, Omega (and of course Dino for dumping the carts). So this could very well be the earliest version of Bobby Is Going Home known to exist. I'll add it to the V5 collection. It's definitely different, but I can't say if it's an earlier or later version unless I find a bug, and then bug fix. The other Ample Ace cart that was different was Mission 3000 AD, and that was a deliberate change. It could be an earlier version, yes. It also could be a way of tracking if someone was pirating their stuff. Making subtle changes in the rom and then hand them out as sample copies. If another company has pirated your rom you'll know what customer you gave it to (providing you make ever sample cart different). That sounds like a lot of work though. Maybe it is an earlier version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mika Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 ... jeez, mate! well done. do you have a website when i can read more of your reviews and analysis? great stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted May 21, 2009 Author Share Posted May 21, 2009 Nope, no time for a website. Please check out Matt's website though. Lots of great (and comical) reviews on there. http://www.atariprotos.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted May 21, 2009 Share Posted May 21, 2009 (edited) Maybe it is an earlier version.I think it is. The gameplay is not as smooth as the released version. Bobby is sinking to his waist in quicksand the moment he lands after jumping. BTW: the reviewed Jacky Jump from Home Vision displayed the same logo as the released version (upper case BIT). Edited May 21, 2009 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted May 21, 2009 Author Share Posted May 21, 2009 The gameplay is not as smooth as the released version. Bobby is sinking to his waist in quicksand the moment he lands after jumping. Good catch Rom, that definitely is a bug. I noticed what you are talking about but never thought to compare it with the other rom. I believe it happens on a screen with retracting bridges. I looked through my disassembly and I think I found the place that is causing it. At least when I NOP'd it out it no longer occured. Since the released version doesn't have this bug I have to agree that this is the earliest version of Bobby Is Going Home ever found. Here's a rough disassembly. I was particulary impressed how the preceding zero's are blanked in the score display. Never got to the starfield though. No time. BobbyIsGoingHome.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangasinan Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 Do you still need Phantom Tank (Puzzy / Bit Corporation) dumped ? on Atarimania it is said to be dumped already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 (edited) I'm certain it's the same ROM as the Goliath version: http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?VERSION_ID=11813&MENU=2 Shark Attack (PAL) and Spacechase (PAL) would wrap up the Apollo dumps. Anyone? Edited September 7, 2009 by Rom Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangasinan Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 (edited) I'm certain it's the same ROM as the Goliath version: http://www.atarimania.com/detail_soft.php?VERSION_ID=11813&MENU=2 Shark Attack (PAL) and Spacechase (PAL) would wrap up the Apollo dumps. Anyone? You should strike out phantom tank from the 1st page then,i can get spacechase and shark attack by Apollo dumped also. Edited September 7, 2009 by pangasinan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted September 7, 2009 Author Share Posted September 7, 2009 I'm certain it's the same ROM as the Goliath version: Well I think it's the same too, it needs to be dumped and compared to proove that it is the same. Anything else is speculation. Dump it if you can Pangasinan, as it hasn't been dumped yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangasinan Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 I'm certain it's the same ROM as the Goliath version: Well I think it's the same too, it needs to be dumped and compared to proove that it is the same. Anything else is speculation. Dump it if you can Pangasinan, as it hasn't been dumped yet. Ok i will get it dumped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 i can get spacechase and shark attack by Apollo dumped also. Perfect. Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Mitch Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 This thread just reminded me of something. ROM check your Battlezone protos in your last release, I think you have them labeled backwards. Mitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted October 5, 2009 Author Share Posted October 5, 2009 Lucky Man with the help of Mitch were able to finally dump an NTSC Z-Tack: http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/117831-who-owns-a-ntsc-z-tack/page__view__findpost__p__1848420 The old dump for Z-Tack was wrong. Given how Bomb carts seem to die (and are rare to begin with), it's great to finally get this done. I also believe the dump for Wall Defender (NTSC) is wrong, but that remains to be seen. Z-Tack (NTSC) correct dump.zip Comparing this NTSC dump to the PAL counterpart, the differences lie in values loaded into the timers, and the values of the color tables. This is expected. I looked for changes in any other areas and couldn't find none. It looks like the dump is 100% good with no bit rot or anything unusual. Dino has also dumped the ultra-rare original style Funvision T-handle Time Warp, the one that looks like this: It's rom is 100% the same as the other Funvision T-handle Time Warp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Thanks, Omega. Did you have a look at Gakken's Marine Wars ROM too? Looks bad to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted October 5, 2009 Author Share Posted October 5, 2009 Thanks, Omega. Did you have a look at Gakken's Marine Wars ROM too? Looks bad to me. What Marine Wars rom? I only know of Z-Tack and Time Warp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Marine Wars (1983) (Gakken) (011) (PAL).bin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebiggw Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Thanks guys alot of hard work going on in this thread!! Now it looks like I got 29 pages of intresting reading to do! and some .bins to check out!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rom Hunter Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Thanks guys alot of hard work going on in this thread!! Now it looks like I got 29 pages of intresting reading to do! and some .bins to check out!! Better download the collection right away: http://www.atarimania.com/roms-MENU-2.html Saves a lot of time (10 years to be exact). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omegamatrix Posted October 5, 2009 Author Share Posted October 5, 2009 Rom, that is a completely bad dump. I also see off of Atarimania's new page that Pangasinan and Dino were able to dump Cosmic War, Journey Escape, and Spacechase. Was there anymore dumps done? Was the last Puzzy game dumped? I'll update the list on the first post. Please let me know what was done (or post the roms here as well) so I can keep it up to date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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