emkay Posted February 13, 2004 Author Share Posted February 13, 2004 5-th player in next version(3.7.6), OK Is it possible to "double" the players per scanline in Hires and GED-mode? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracon Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 I'm not completely sure about it... but there are available certain assembler commands when doing raster changes.... You've to check them out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 13, 2004 Author Share Posted February 13, 2004 I'm not completely sure about it... but there are available certain assembler commands when doing raster changes.... You've to check them out! Well... the actual version does not.... The question was for that new Version. That's why I quoted Tebe directly.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 This was an idea I was concidering on an old routine I worked on a long time ago, As far as I know, the PMG vector is initialised after each scanline has hsync'ed so multiplexing on the same scanline isn't possible... That is as far as I could gather after further checking out Mapping the Atari, De Re, Compute's books etc.. But i guess much of what you guys are doing today was deemed imposible back then.. It would be great if it was possible but surley there is no more CPU time left in the interupt. I used to count the maximum CPU cycles available to plan my routines, there's some web links that escape me at the moment that go into detail about this I will read them later on today and pass it on to you all although I'm sure most of you will have greater knowledge about this already.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Forgot to mention this previous post which goes into the subject.. http://www.atariage.com/forums/viewtopic.p...ultiplex+sprite also this quote on that post from Fröhn: ... "horizontal multiplexing will not work since the sprite shifters are only loaded once per rasterline." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 tezz... fröhn is talking about c64... not atari... on atari you can definitly multiplex sprites in one scanline... search analmux post regarding his multiplex demo where he shows how to... your dli code would look like this: dli pha sta wsync lda #position1 sta hposp0 nop nop nop lda #position2 sta hposp0+1 pla rti so no magic here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 dli pha sta wsync lda #position1 sta hposp0 nop nop nop lda #position2 sta hposp0 pla rti of course... made little mistake... and g2f is prepared for that as in GED mode you can alter the multiplexed register doesnt matter if its a colour or a sprite register... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 wow! yes after reading further it is possible after all. That's really impresive, I have seen analmux's routine now. ... g2f is prepared for that as in GED mode you can alter the multiplexed register doesnt matter if its a colour or a sprite register... I guess this is only possible in bitmap GED mode only after reading the posts regarding the timing issues, Can all 4 PMs be repositioned in GED mode. and can the size also be altered? I wonder if it would be ever possible to multiplex PMs in graphics 12 "font mode" which provides the extra usefull "inverse" colour register? This would make so much more possible. I guess this would be the limit then in terms of what is possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 13, 2004 Author Share Posted February 13, 2004 I wonder if it would be ever possible to multiplex PMs in graphics 12 "font mode" which provides the extra usefull "inverse" colour register? This would make so much more possible. I guess this would be the limit then in terms of what is possible. I every first scanline of a charmode, midline changes are not possible ... so multiplexing for PM in that lines is not possible. For the rest of the scanlines it is the same like in bitmap mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Emkay wrote... every first scanline of a charmode, midline changes are not possible ... so multiplexing for PM in that lines is not possible. For the rest of the scanlines it is the same like in bitmap mode. Ah right OK... I would say that missing the first scanline would be a minor thing to live with, I hope Tebe makes this available in a future release... By the way, is it possible to multiplex 1,2,3 or all 4 PMs per scanline in the current GED mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analmux Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 By the way, is it possible to multiplex 1,2,3 or all 4 PMs per scanline in the current GED mode. Could be, it really depends on what you want to change about a Player or Missile. First let's only concentrate on muxing players, as muxing missiles is hardly worth the effort. When you multiplex a player you'll always need to reposition. That's at least 6 cpu cycles per player: lda #newposition = 2 cycles sta hposp0/1/2/3 = 4 cycles Suppose we want to change shapes too then that's additional 6 cycles per player: lda #newshape = 2 cycles sta grafp0/1/2/3 = 4 cycles Now we might want a colorchange, then another 6 cycles. (and eventually we want to change the width of the players) So if we want to change them for ALL 4 players --> 4*3*6 = 72 cycles. In GED we have only a 40 cycle wide range on screen (minus 9 DRAM refresh cycles on left part of screen), so it won't be possible. I think without any PlayField gfx turned on it IS possible to do it. We have a maximum of 5 registerchanges on screen in GED, so you can make a choice: -change all registers of one player, and just reposition or recolor a second player. -just reposition/resize all players (hey, what about resizing a player at the half of a scanline: bits: 76543333222211110000 ) -....and so on Note: not in all situations we need changing of all three registers (hpospx/grafpx/colpx) of all players, so we might be able to multiplex them all, especially in repeated graphics (like the bitter reality screenshot from emkay: repeated sine textbar at the left AND the right side of the screen). --------- ...and to all: don't forget the so important registers grafp0-3 Are these registers supported in GED mode too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tebe Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 multiple Player0 (color RED, 6 positions) player1 - green player2 - blue player3 - brown g2f example in zip_file (mode GED--) if you want change sprite data, you must disabled DMA for PMG and filled 2 register -> position and GRAPH_pm (max in one line 3 different positions, and data) 6 positions (G2F -> Edit Rasters ... global ofset=-2), 36 visible CPU cycle: lda #$44 ldx #$68 ldy #$86 sta $d000 stx $d000 sty $d000 lda #$a8 ldx #$b8 ldy #$c8 sta $d000 stx $d000 sty $d000 test_multiple_pmg.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 13, 2004 Author Share Posted February 13, 2004 Here is another example in hires Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pps Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Just a short introduction, what I´m working on... starsoftlogowip.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted February 13, 2004 Author Share Posted February 13, 2004 @tebe In the version 3.7.5 your G2F does not show any PM-multiplexing. The XEX-File works fine in the emulator. So, which version are you using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pps Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 @emkay: perhaps he uses the 3.7.5.2 which is actually downloadable... or a new beta? Your highres picture looks cool Nice to have more than 1 luminance on this mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tebe Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 3.7.5.2 (bugs killed) multiplexed PMG works only in the emulator and true atari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracon Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Your highres picture looks cool Nice to have more than 1 luminance on this mode. yeah, decent result. But what about colorful pictures in hires then? As you can see there is a picture named "DIABLIK" in G2F package.... And this is colorful hires but sprites are partly visible on area that they definitely shouldn't be... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pps Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 But what about colorful pictures in hires then?As you can see there is a picture named "DIABLIK" in G2F package.... And this is colorful hires but sprites are partly visible on area that they definitely shouldn't be... If the STARSOFT Logo is finished, I´ll try out "Gr.8"-Mode. But I think, the matter is, that you´ll have to use non strechted PM for that. The priority restrictions in Gr.8 are not really useful. Only 2 of the players can really be behind "Color 1". EDIT: Just recognized, that I´m wrong with this... All players are some kind of transparent ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 emkay....and this one rocks as well... time to code a slideshow??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analmux Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Now, let me introduce "The Gate". Done by me in august 2003, handcoded at that time, now converted to G2F format. I've included two g2f-files in the ZIP. In gate_v4.g2f I didn't paint (cut) the sprites yet, to give you a feeling how the color areas are divided. gate_v5.g2f is the final version. (By the way: no GED used) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven/TQA Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 yup...can remember the pic... it's kind of cool how many people here on the board have drove further atari's capabilities... esp. 2003/2004... have you coded atari today? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analmux Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 have you coded atari today? No, I think we're finally reaching the stage where we don't code anymore. Just use PC tools to make gfx and msx and put the whole thing together. .....off course I'm kidding. I won't ever stop coding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tezz Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Hi all, I know it's been asked for many times, but can anyone translate the G2F documents to english? the majority of the program is straight forward to follow but particularly the EDIT RASTERS (ALT+A) section would be nice to read to be able to fully use scanline changes. I've personally concidered online Polish -> English translation sites such as http://www.poltran.com/ which gives some reasonable results although of course it's mainly just technical terminology used which it won't cover very well. I'm extremely happy to see that multiplexing of Players may be included soon for Font mode, I have several projects half finished hoping that this appears soon. that feature even with limitations above any other would make a world of difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tebe Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 new g2f pictures 2xg2f.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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